16 replies to this topic

[R32Egor]

hi

 

I have an SPI mini 1996 LHD (so driver and petrol tank on LH side) running 165/60 12 with mamba wheels (ET -3 i believe).

shocks - kayaba gas a adjust standard

all the aftermarket adjustable suspension kits

engine standard mounted to subframe and subframe hard mounted to body

full adjustable raer brackets

 

so suspension has now been setup correctly -

 

Front -

 

 

Back -

 

 

'SPUR' is toe and 'sturz' is camber

 

the left hand rear wheel toe has now been corrected and is basically the same as the Right hand wheel.

 

Ride height measured form the body is the same side to side.

 

NOW the question -

 

the handling feedback from turning left is alot better than when turning right. A left turn i can throw it into the turn no problem and you can feel the grip but a right hand turn feels less grippy but still actually turns.

 

Could the feeling be down to the difference in weight on the lh of the car compared to the right? And with that do you think i would benefit from adjustable shocks so i could tweek the stiffness on the lh side compared to the rh side to improve the handling??

 

any thpoughts? 

 

Edited by R32Egor, 23 July 2024 - 05:44 PM.

[Spider]

I see there's about 1/2⁰ difference in camber between front wheels.

There's not really enough information in that to draw any answers from, including King Pin Angle and Figures when Turned. These are static numbers in a straight ahead position. Variances can (and often do) occur when steering around corners.

[imack]

I see there's about 1/2⁰ difference in camber between front wheels.

There's not really enough information in that to draw any answers from, including King Pin Angle and Figures when Turned. These are static numbers in a straight ahead position. Variances can (and often do) occur when steering around corners.

1/2° difference in camber?, I'm only seeing 3 minutes difference.
There is some toe out on the o/s rear and toe in on the n/s rear.
34 minutes total toe on the front seems quite a lot (around 3mm) I'd have expected around half that amount.
Has it been corner weighted?

Edited by imack, 23 July 2024 - 06:47 PM.

[nicklouse]

You say the ride height has been set but have you set the corner weights? Very easy to have a three legged stool and all the lengths are the same but the fourth Leg is not supporting its share of the load.

[R32Egor]

 

I see there's about 1/2⁰ difference in camber between front wheels.

There's not really enough information in that to draw any answers from, including King Pin Angle and Figures when Turned. These are static numbers in a straight ahead position. Variances can (and often do) occur when steering around corners.

1/2° difference in camber?, I'm only seeing 3 minutes difference.
There is some toe out on the o/s rear and toe in on the n/s rear.
34 minutes total toe on the front seems quite a lot (around 3mm) I'd have expected around half that amount.
Has it been corner weighted?

 

 

Correct only 3 minutes difference in camber on front

But -

 

The rear both have toe in the LH side has less than the RH side in the pics above - but I have corrected this and they are basically the same at 11 minutes toe in that is on a 12" wheel -

approx 1.0 mm - a little less than the 1/16" per side that the gurus say it should be (Calver)

Again on the front it is recommended 1/16" toe out which with 12" wheels is 1.6mm each side - -18 minutes each side - so as far as I can see I am good.

 

It has not been corner weighted - but looking at the method do i really need this for b road driving - I am not going on the track for competitions.

[R32Egor]

would the - 10 minutes of camber on the RH rear wheel be the difference in the handling?

[Spider]

Correct only 3 minutes difference in camber on front

 

 

Yes, - sorry - senior's moment !
 

[68+86auto]

The front toe should be 14 minutes toe out total so half of what you have. The rear should be about 30 minutes toe in. Note mm/inch measurements are a poor way to measure alignments, it depends on the equipment as to what diameter it actually refers to.

 

 

would the - 10 minutes of camber on the RH rear wheel be the difference in the handling?

 

No.

 

The data you have given is ok other than the front toe. Even that will be ok but wear the tyres more than necessary. Your problem is likely to do with the "toe out on turns" (TOOT). There is probably a bent or mismatched arm or the tie rods have been unevenly adjusted (alignment not done with the rack centred). Please give us those values. A lot of alignment "technicians" are too lazy to do this step even though it is very important. This will also give the KPI reading.

 

 

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Edited by 68+86auto, 26 July 2024 - 11:26 AM.

[R32Egor]

OK BUT -

 

The suspension is basically brand new the only old parts are the front upper arms but with new bearings etc. so for sure no bent parts

The toe/suspension settings were done with the rack centred because it was done by me - with an actual allenkey in the rack centering hole

 

I would have to get the mini back into the workshop and measure this to check - another €50! lets see if i can do this in the next couple weeks.

[68+86auto]

OK BUT -
 
The suspension is basically brand new the only old parts are the front upper arms but with new bearings etc. so for sure no bent parts
The toe/suspension settings were done with the rack centred because it was done by me - with an actual allenkey in the rack centering hole
 
I would have to get the mini back into the workshop and measure this to check - another €50! lets see if i can do this in the next couple weeks.

Maybe you could find out if they did actually measure the T.O.O.T. and it's recorded.

If the T.O.O.T. is correct then everything looks good. Your issue is most likely not an alignment one then. I can tell you all about alignment values and procedures but I can't say much about handling.

[mbolt998]

Are you testing this on flat ground? Roads in the UK mostly have quite a camber on them and, unless they're single-track, this generally means that left-hand bends are practically banked turns, whereas right-hand ones are off-camber unless you have good enough visibility to use the wrong side of the road. The same corner can often be tackled at considerably more speed in one direction than the other. In fact I think one of the reasons Minis corner so fast in the real world is they are small enough, and so easy to place on the road, that you can get right inside that camber in a way you can't in most other cars.

[Denish2024]

I have a severe pull left when lifting off accelerator, please help

[MiNiKiN]

OK BUT -

 

The suspension is basically brand new the only old parts are the front upper arms but with new bearings etc. so for sure no bent parts

The toe/suspension settings were done with the rack centred because it was done by me - with an actual allenkey in the rack centering hole

 

I would have to get the mini back into the workshop and measure this to check - another €50! lets see if i can do this in the next couple weeks.

Have you got the right and equal length steering arms on either side?
What track rod ends have you fitted - the minispares longer competition track rod ends allegedly cause bump steer - something to do with the ackerman angle over suspension travel.
My main suspect is the above mentioned T.O.O.T., It is likely the cause for your issue. Or as spider said the wheel loads. They should usually be measured before any wheel measurements.

Gruß vom Innviertler in Graz nach Schärding

Edited by MiNiKiN, 31 July 2024 - 09:27 AM.

[68+86auto]

I have a severe pull left when lifting off accelerator, please help

 

As a start, check for play and worn bushes.

[Lplus]

 

I have a severe pull left when lifting off accelerator, please help

 

As a start, check for play and worn bushes.

 

Also check for a loose steering arm on one of the hubs.