32 replies to this topic

[stuart bowes]

if the insert comes out with the plug surely it's a fairly easy job to refit or replace it with some locktite (or do that in the first place)  better outcome that than it being stuck in there and the thead damaged anyway

 

I was probably going to do mine on the engine stripdown anyway as preventative measure, as Java says it's easier done on the bench instead of finding out later once it's all fitted

 

guess it depends what the condition is when you've taken it apart

[Snorlax]

 

 

I’m not a big fan of helicoils for sump plug use. Too many oil changes and, one day, the helicoil will come out attached to the sump plug.
TimeSerts are a much more reliable fix. Not cheap but worth it, in my experience.

Where would you get a TimeSert from and are they difficult to fit?

I think it's Wurth who sells timeserts.
Very expensive if you have to buy the tooling to do it.
If you know someone with the tooling for that size go for the timesert

 

 

It may have to just be a helicoil for now until I find someone with the correct tool. 

 

Hoping to get the mini to my unit tomorrow and will drop the oil out kinda praying i will get away with just fitting a washer as it currently doesnt have one. 

 

Watch this space haha.

[Cooperman]

There's nothing wrong with a Helicoil so long as it's installed correctly. In fact, where a steel bolt goes into an aluminium casing it's quite usual to fit a Helicoil as original, this being done on aircraft engines in many cases. Done properly it's a permanent repair.

[sonscar]

Bear in mind that if it comes out when driving your engine and gearbox life will be measured in seconds.Helicoil it.Steve..

[Snorlax]

There's nothing wrong with a Helicoil so long as it's installed correctly. In fact, where a steel bolt goes into an aluminium casing it's quite usual to fit a Helicoil as original, this being done on aircraft engines in many cases. Done properly it's a permanent repair.

 

Thanks :)

 

When doing a Helicoil the little tab end you use for inserting it will that break off and sit in the sump once the bolt is in?

[Cooperman]

The standard sump plug has a built in magnet, or you could magnetise the end of a screwdriver to pick it out.
As a temporary measure you could clean all the oil from the threads and use an adhesive to seal the plug in. There are some excellent adhesives on the market and even a simple 'Instant Gasket' sealer would work. Something like 'JB Weld' would also work, but it might be overkill.

[Snorlax]

The standard sump plug has a built in magnet, or you could magnetise the end of a screwdriver to pick it out.
As a temporary measure you could clean all the oil from the threads and use an adhesive to seal the plug in. There are some excellent adhesives on the market and even a simple 'Instant Gasket' sealer would work. Something like 'JB Weld' would also work, but it might be overkill.

 

Ok so it should get picked up fairly quickly from the plug magnet?

Im just worried it going round the system as such.

[stuart bowes]

 

There's nothing wrong with a Helicoil so long as it's installed correctly. In fact, where a steel bolt goes into an aluminium casing it's quite usual to fit a Helicoil as original, this being done on aircraft engines in many cases. Done properly it's a permanent repair.

 

Thanks :)

 

When doing a Helicoil the little tab end you use for inserting it will that break off and sit in the sump once the bolt is in?

 

 

on the video I watched he used a punch to pop that tab off, it's notched to break off easily.

 

he did it into a blind hole and then shook it out after but in a sump/gearbox you'd want to retrieve that before driving presumably 

 

(+1 for doing the job on a bench instead of on the car although in your case I know that's a redundant point)

Edited by stuart bowes, 03 July 2024 - 03:34 PM.

[nicklouse]

You can get tabless inserts.

[Nial81]

I tapped mine out bigger then fitted a brass reducer to bring it back to a common size for a sump plug. I can't remember the sizes off hand. The brass reducer stays permanently in place and there's a better choice of aftermarket sump plugs.

[Cooperman]

Unless you can get it properly Helicoiled, thus is what I suggest.

Drain all the oil out,

Jack the car up as high as it will do on the RH side so that any oil residue in the sump drains away from the drain hole.

Thoroughly clean the remains of the threads in the drain hole using 'Brake and Clutch Cleaner' with a 1/4" paint brush and clean rag.

Clean the sump plug threads similarly.

Clean the sealing washer similarly.

Mix Araldite in exactly the right amounts and liberally coat the sump plug threads and washer.

Re-install it and turn it until it's in as far as it will go.

Leave the car jacked up for 24 hours until the Araldite has fully hardened.

Let the car down, re-fill with the correct oil and drive it. It will not leak.

 

At the next oil change, decide whether to repeat this or to fit a Helicoil. I promise you it will work as I had to do it on a rally Mini many years ago when the thread was stripped a couple of days before the event. It didn't leak!

[Shooter63]

While timeserts are the best option apart from the Spider/Shooter threaded sleeve :) spending £250.00 on a timesert kit to me is a bit on the strong side, you can probably buy everything you need to do a helicoil for around £30.00. They way I've done them in the past with the engine in the car is as so
Jack the car up so the engine is running down towards the sump plug.
Remove the tie rod, which gives you room to operate in.
Sneak up on the required tapping drill size in .5mm increment blacksmith type drills,these type of bits allow you to keep a straight shot at the offending hole, this will stop the drill grabing and trying to tear your arm out of its socket and will keep everything in line, grease all drill bits to collect swarf.
Fit the helicoil as per instructions but add a drop of thread lock and leave for a bit.
Remove the tang using long nose pliers, this way there is no chance of said tang getting lost in the engine.

Shooter

[Snorlax]

Thanks shooter. I didn’t think about long nose pliers appreciate the help all :)

[Quinlan minor]

Yes, it’s Wurth who do them and the whole kit is not cheap. Best to find a specialist who has the kit and get them to do it.

[Snorlax]

Yes, it’s Wurth who do them and the whole kit is not cheap. Best to find a specialist who has the kit and get them to do it.

 

Am I correct in thinking I will need a M16 Helicoil?

 

Would I just get a Classic mini Sump plug size too?