17 replies to this topic

[soulslinga]

hello - 

i have a MK1 countryman 1965.

 

trying to get my little light bulb with the green lens on the tip of the indicator switch to work. blinkers/turn signals on the outside of the car work.

i read the other posts that got me this far (linked below for reference). but i am stuck !

 

coming out of my turn indicator switch is a solid green wire that i believe controls the light bulb on the tip of the indicator turn switch inside the car, with the green lens. 

from other posts on this forum (below links) i know that light green/purple wire coming out of the loom is supposed to control that bulb and be plugged into 'P' on the flasher unit. 

 

so for some reason the solid green wire coming out of the turn indicator switch had been cut. i fastened a bullet connector to it (my first time making a wire) and it still didnt seem to work. here is what i also tried : 

 

- multimeter - new to electronics but i'm not sure i'm getting any signal when i put the tester inside the light bulb socket. from what i can tell the other cables on the switch are getting readings. 

- multimeter on flasher unit itself - the P connection (where the LGP light green purple cable goes) never seems to output any readings. 

- tried two flasher units - i have a new-ish flasher unit for the MK1 from minimania and a more generic 3 prong flasher unit. both seem to have the issue. outside flahsers/turn indicator lights work with both flasher units. 

- i made a wire and replaced the light green purple LGP cable, just ran it temporarily outside the car to the loom at the turn switch. and it didnt seem to work. so i guess the LGP light green purple in the loom is still good??

- i have tried a new bulb

- turn switch itself is Mk1 type, about two years old from minimania. i have the original switch that came with the car. i troubleshot with it but that has the same issue, outside flashers work but inside indicator doesnt, BUT on the old one the area around the bulb is badly burned, so that might be a totally different issue, not much help . 

 

the only thing i havent tried yet is adding a ground. which i heard works for some? 

 

i referenced these posts : 

https://www.theminif...turn +indicator

https://www.theminif...turn +indicator

and

https://www.theminif...or#entry3259439

 

 

 

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[Spider]

The lamp does need a decent Earth which if I recall, is through the body of the switch itself. If there's excess paint under the Switch and / or the Column Bracket where it bolts up to the parcel shelf, of the bracket on to the parcel shelf, it will interfere with this. Use your meter to do a continuity test between the chrome on the indicator stalk and a good earth on the body.

The other thing to check using your multimeter is to see if you are getting a signal out of the flasher can, Set it to volts and see if you get a 'flashing' voltage between the Lt Green / Purple Wire and Earth. Put the Indicators on to one side, with the Key on and you should see a rise and fall voltage here.

[johnR]

I also recall having to earth my steering rack to get it to work

[soulslinga]

The lamp does need a decent Earth which if I recall, is through the body of the switch itself. If there's excess paint under the Switch and / or the Column Bracket where it bolts up to the parcel shelf, of the bracket on to the parcel shelf, it will interfere with this. Use your meter to do a continuity test between the chrome on the indicator stalk and a good earth on the body.

The other thing to check using your multimeter is to see if you are getting a signal out of the flasher can, Set it to volts and see if you get a 'flashing' voltage between the Lt Green / Purple Wire and Earth. Put the Indicators on to one side, with the Key on and you should see a rise and fall voltage here.

 

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described. 

 

also i tried grounding it in the following ways, take a look at these pics and let me know what you think? the green cable is the ground cable i made. 

 

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Edited by soulslinga, 23 January 2023 - 06:33 PM.

[soulslinga]

I also recall having to earth my steering rack to get it to work

do you recall exactly how you hooked that up? thanks for any info! 

[Spider]

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described. 

i tested the ground on the turn switch by holding one end of the multimeter on the battery ground iteself and the other end on the turn switch. i got a strong signal. not sure if i'm doing that correctly or in an idiotic way. 

then i connected a wire to the screw on the turn signal stalk and i touched the other end of the wire to some grounding points, i didnt firmly connect it as i have no aligator clips. but the light didnt work. 

sorry that i require extreme hand holding thru this but i do appreciate the help!

 

OK, so we have narrowed it down somewhat.

Have you tested that the bulb itself works ?

Do a Continuity Test between the Green wire on the stalk (which connects to the Lt Green / Purple of the harness) to the Bulb Holder, it should be the centre contact in that.

Do another continuity test to the Earth contact of the Bulb Holder too.

 

 

 

I also recall having to earth my steering rack to get it to work

 

do you recall exactly how you hooked that up? thanks for any info!

 

Yes, the rack does need an Earth in these cars, but that's for the Horn.
 

[soulslinga]

 

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described. 

i tested the ground on the turn switch by holding one end of the multimeter on the battery ground iteself and the other end on the turn switch. i got a strong signal. not sure if i'm doing that correctly or in an idiotic way. 

then i connected a wire to the screw on the turn signal stalk and i touched the other end of the wire to some grounding points, i didnt firmly connect it as i have no aligator clips. but the light didnt work. 

sorry that i require extreme hand holding thru this but i do appreciate the help!

 

OK, so we have narrowed it down somewhat.

Have you tested that the bulb itself works ?

Do a Continuity Test between the Green wire on the stalk (which connects to the Lt Green / Purple of the harness) to the Bulb Holder, it should be the centre contact in that.

Do another continuity test to the Earth contact of the Bulb Holder too.

 

 

thanks for the walk thru!

 

- bulb appears to work testing via multimeter. i also have a spare/new bulb that i tried. unless i've blown them both with all this. 

- continuity test between the way green wire on the stalk to center contact inside the bulb holder - that works!!! 

- continuity test between earth contact of the bulb holder  -- see the photos of where i held the multimeter for this test. i appear to get a continuity reading holding in all these spots: 

 

thank you again for any help ! 

 

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[weef]

The directinoal indicator wiring on these early vehicles is relitively simple, but if you are new to electrics it may appear complicated. 

Start with the basics, the flasher control unit should be a three terminal device the terminals being identified as "B"  "L"  and "P".

The three wires connected to this device should be as follows.

Terminal "B" should have a solid GREEN wire, the ignition switched supply connected to it.

Terminal "L" should have a LIGHT GREEN/BROWN wire feeding the common terminal of the column mounted switch.

Terminal "P" should have a LIGHT GREEN/PURPLE wire feeding the lamp centre terminal on the end of the column mounted switch.

I do not think there are any colour changes at the colomn  bullet junctions and presuming this to be correct proceed as follows.

Disconnect the three wires at the flasher control unit and using a continuity tester check the integrity of these wires.

The GREEN wire should go to the ignition switched fuse, the LIGHT GREEN/BROWN should go to the bullet junction terminal on the column feeding the common of the column switch and the LIGHT/GREEN PURPLE should go to the bullet junction terminal on the column and then to the centre terminal of the lampholder on the column mounted switch. 

The outer bulb terminal on the lampholder shoud go to earth.

If this is not the case rectify any anomilies then reconnect the wires to the flasher control unit.

Now using a test lamp as opposed to a multimeter test the following.

Fit a known good bulb to the column lampholder and switch on the ignition, power will be on the GREEN wire feeding the flasher unit and the LIGHT GREEN/BROWN feeding the common of the column mounted switch.

Now switch the column switch ON, either right or left, and still working at the flasher control unit there should be a "flashing" supply on the LIGHT GREEN/BROWN and the LIGHT GREEN/PURPLE  terminals of the control unit, if not rectify any anomilies and all will work as designed. This is presuming that the external lamps and wiring are correct.

The above description is how the system works and should help you in faultfinding your problem.

[Spider]

thanks for the walk thru!

 

- bulb appears to work testing via multimeter. i also have a spare/new bulb that i tried. unless i've blown them both with all this. 

- continuity test between the way green wire on the stalk to center contact inside the bulb holder - that works!!! 

- continuity test between earth contact of the bulb holder  -- see the photos of where i held the multimeter for this test. i appear to get a continuity reading holding in all these spots: 

 

thank you again for any help !

 

One last thing I can think of here.

The Bulb may not be making contact down in the bottom of it's holder.

I'm not sure how to check this in a physical way, maybe some felt tip marker on the bulb contact and see if it marks after screwing it in ? The bulb might be bottoming out in it's threads before contact is made.

 

I'd also suggest here, if you put 12 V on to the Green Wire (of the stalk), the bulb should come on.If your horn works, you could pick up 12V from the Purple / Black wire on the harness at the stalk, it'll be coming from the horn, so it should well be enough to bring the bulb on.

[johnR]

 

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described. 

i tested the ground on the turn switch by holding one end of the multimeter on the battery ground iteself and the other end on the turn switch. i got a strong signal. not sure if i'm doing that correctly or in an idiotic way. 

then i connected a wire to the screw on the turn signal stalk and i touched the other end of the wire to some grounding points, i didnt firmly connect it as i have no aligator clips. but the light didnt work. 

sorry that i require extreme hand holding thru this but i do appreciate the help!

 

OK, so we have narrowed it down somewhat.

Have you tested that the bulb itself works ?

Do a Continuity Test between the Green wire on the stalk (which connects to the Lt Green / Purple of the harness) to the Bulb Holder, it should be the centre contact in that.

Do another continuity test to the Earth contact of the Bulb Holder too.

 

 

 

I also recall having to earth my steering rack to get it to work

 

do you recall exactly how you hooked that up? thanks for any info!

 

Yes, the rack does need an Earth in these cars, but that's for the Horn.
 

 

Ahh yes - I think I had to scrape paint off the column to earth the indicator stalk clamp to it

[soulslinga]

 

thanks for the walk thru!

 

- bulb appears to work testing via multimeter. i also have a spare/new bulb that i tried. unless i've blown them both with all this. 

- continuity test between the way green wire on the stalk to center contact inside the bulb holder - that works!!! 

- continuity test between earth contact of the bulb holder  -- see the photos of where i held the multimeter for this test. i appear to get a continuity reading holding in all these spots: 

 

thank you again for any help !

 

One last thing I can think of here.

The Bulb may not be making contact down in the bottom of it's holder.

I'm not sure how to check this in a physical way, maybe some felt tip marker on the bulb contact and see if it marks after screwing it in ? The bulb might be bottoming out in it's threads before contact is made.

 

I'd also suggest here, if you put 12 V on to the Green Wire (of the stalk), the bulb should come on.If your horn works, you could pick up 12V from the Purple / Black wire on the harness at the stalk, it'll be coming from the horn, so it should well be enough to bring the bulb on.

 

 

thank you again for all this help! i've made some progress based on your advice. when i plug the green cable from the bulb into the horn's purple/black cable, the light on the turn stalk comes on!

so the bulb and socket works. 

 

any other ideas? 

[Spider]

thank you again for all this help! i've made some progress based on your advice. when i plug the green cable from the bulb into the horn's purple/black cable, the light on the turn stalk comes on!

so the bulb and socket works. 

 

any other ideas?

 

 

I just re-read what we have covered and sorry, I miss-read this one (bolding is mine);-

 

 

The other thing to check using your multimeter is to see if you are getting a signal out of the flasher can, Set it to volts and see if you get a 'flashing' voltage between the Lt Green / Purple Wire and Earth. Put the Indicators on to one side, with the Key on and you should see a rise and fall voltage here.

 

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described.

 

 

Well,,,, we have eliminated the stalk and everything to do with that !!

 

There's no signal coming from the Flasher Can.

 

Repeat the above test, being sure the Indicators (outside) are flashing, only, measure for a voltage on the Flasher Can itself, on the P terminal, You should be able to get your probe in the back of the Socket. To check that you have a food connection for testing, try first on the L terminal, if you see that rises and falls, then try the P terminal. If there's nothing on the P terminal, then the flasher can isn't working as it should. If you are getting a voltage here, then there's an issue with the wire or a connector on it between here and the stalk.

 

[soulslinga]

 

thank you again for all this help! i've made some progress based on your advice. when i plug the green cable from the bulb into the horn's purple/black cable, the light on the turn stalk comes on!

so the bulb and socket works. 

 

any other ideas?

 

 

I just re-read what we have covered and sorry, I miss-read this one (bolding is mine);-

 

 

The other thing to check using your multimeter is to see if you are getting a signal out of the flasher can, Set it to volts and see if you get a 'flashing' voltage between the Lt Green / Purple Wire and Earth. Put the Indicators on to one side, with the Key on and you should see a rise and fall voltage here.

 

thank you so much for this info! so i did the multimeter test on the flasher unit. i held one side of the multimeter to a ground and touched the other to the LGP light green/purple wire at the flasher unit. i didnt get voltage like you described.

 

 

Well,,,, we have eliminated the stalk and everything to do with that !!

 

There's no signal coming from the Flasher Can.

 

Repeat the above test, being sure the Indicators (outside) are flashing, only, measure for a voltage on the Flasher Can itself, on the P terminal, You should be able to get your probe in the back of the Socket. To check that you have a food connection for testing, try first on the L terminal, if you see that rises and falls, then try the P terminal. If there's nothing on the P terminal, then the flasher can isn't working as it should. If you are getting a voltage here, then there's an issue with the wire or a connector on it between here and the stalk.

 

 

 

WOW thanks for your patience, so i picked up an electronic flasher unit at the parts store and it didnt quite work, so i went back and exchanged for it a more old school 'thermal' flasher and that worked!!!! BUT one caveat, the little green light now never turns off lol... it flashes when i hit the turn switch (GREAT!!) but when i turn it off, the little green stays on as long as the ignition key is on. Also the light is noticably dimmer than it was when i hooked it directly to the horn's power earlier.

I could live with it after this long battle! But maybe if i picked up the 'official' flasher unit from minispares or 7ent then that will do the trick and work properly...? 

Either way, i've come a long way, thanks for helping me fumble thru this! 

Edited by soulslinga, 25 January 2023 - 09:45 PM.

[weef]

It might be worth a try to swap the LIGHTGREEN/ BROWN and the LIGHT GREEN/PURPLE wires on the flasher can to see if the stalk green light and the external lamps work as designed.

[Spider]

WOW thanks for your patience, so i picked up an electronic flasher unit at the parts store and it didnt quite work, so i went back and exchanged for it a more old school 'thermal' flasher and that worked!!!! BUT one caveat, the little green light now never turns off lol... it flashes when i hit the turn switch (GREAT!!) but when i turn it off, the little green stays on as long as the ignition key is on. Also the light is noticably dimmer than it was when i hooked it directly to the horn's power earlier.

I could live with it after this long battle! But maybe if i picked up the 'official' flasher unit from minispares or 7ent then that will do the trick and work properly...? 

Either way, i've come a long way, thanks for helping me fumble thru this!

 

It does sound to me like the wrong flasher can, there are quite a few different 3 Pin types, though, at least in these parts, they type needed for the MKI Mini is quite common.

I'm not sure what after-market brands you have there for auto electrical stuff, but what you need is an equivalent to a Hella 3003. I'd suggest an old school thermal type of can instead of the electronic types as many of those need a separate earth to the can and are silent in operation.