37 replies to this topic

[Foobah]

Hi everyone,

 

I decided to start a new thread on this to keep it as simple as possible.

 

SC built a new 1380 engine for my '93 SPi. It came with the Delta ECU and harness etc.

 

Everything in front of the dashboard is now new.

 

We can get it running but it is extremely rough up to c3500 and runs very rich.

 

We have fiddled around with the variables in line with the instructions dowloaded from SC but are now just stumped and dont know where to go. The local rolling-road said they couldn't help not being familiar with the Delta ECU.

 

I have attached a couple of screen shots showing gauges at a cooler temp and a bit warmer.

 

When cold it wont idle despite (I think) the right data going into the ECU variables. Once its warm it idles at aroudn a 1000rpm fluctating a little. It has quite an aggressive cam, but not so aggressive it would cause the type of running problem I have; its a fast road engine rather than a race engine.

 

SC sent me a video of the engine on their bench dyno running sweetly. Im guessing this was set up to their own ECU and not the one they sent with the engine they built.

 

We have been down all routes suggested on previous threads so far as I can see.

 

We can only think its something to do with the fueling.

 

We've tried a new coil/Spark Plugs/HT leads/disconnecting the alternator.

 

Can anyone help (before I jump off the roof).

 

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Cheers everyone.

Damian

 

[mini13]

it does look well rich, I would check the fuel pressure is ok, in case it is over pressuring and richening the whole map up form where it was set up to.

 

after that I would save the current setup ( so you can load it up if you screw anything), and then lean out the whole map up to circa 3k, it looks like the ecu is l;ooking at the lamda is trying to lean it by its max amout EGO correction amount (20%) the map will be in miliseconds of injectior time, so for ewample 2ms, take down to say 1.75ms. and see if you can get it running ok at idle & cruise.

 

do also have a spare set of plugs or two, as they ofern dont like haveing been too fuely.

[mini13]

also do get a timing light on there to check what the ECU says your advance is, is what the engine is doing.

[Sprocket]

Does this system still use a defined pulse width VE table. What I mean by that is, base fuel table values are actual pulse width?

Tell us more about the whole set up. Are you using the factory SPi manifold or the SC throttle body kit. What size injectors fitte? Same as the ones SC ran the engine up on the dyno. Fuel system, how have you bin the fuel lines and pressure regulator? Have you confirmed the correct fuel pressure at the injectors with a guage?

Can you data log? And represent the data in a graph?

Certainly looking at the pictures about which only capture a single data point the fueling does appear to be nearly 30% rich. If it’s that rich mostly where you are trying to run the engine, then you simply try and scale down the entire base fuel map by 30% but without seeing the calibration file and a comprehensive data log it’s going to be increasingly difficult to bottom it out. If anyone knows exactly what’s going on with it it would be SC, and if they are not fourthcoming you really need to find someone that is. It might cost a little, but there are tuning houses out there that know this system.

Edited by Sprocket, 21 June 2018 - 03:01 PM.

[tmsmini]

Which fuel pump are you using?  Testing pressure is a good idea.

Saving a backup of the existing MAP is an absolute must and everytime before any major changes are made.

 

The Delta ECUs do have a different interface from the Typhoon. I have been meaning to bench test one, but I am getting ready for a trip in our Travellers, so that won't happen for a few weeks.

Terry

[Allrounder]

Can you post a screen shot of the base maps too, fuel and spark.

[dotmatrix]

not that it matters with your fuelling problem, but the wheel circumfence looks way off. should be something like 1600mm for 13" wheels shouldn't it?

[Foobah]

Thanks a million everyone. I'm tied up until early next week and then will get back with some more info.
Does anyone know a decent tuner/rolling road in the North East/North?
Cheers all,
Damian

[IvorBiota]

I can recommend Dennis Vessy in Barnetby.

http://www.vessey-cl...tm#.WyzRzorTXmo

They sorted out my Weber 45 and Delta 400 ECU. Very friendly crew and keen on minis and any other classic.

[Foobah]

I can answer a coupe of the questions asked from the thread.

It has a new MPi fuel pump as SC directed. Its new and just went straight in.

The fuel pressure isn't regulated with anything in addition to the standard set up.

The fuel lines are all new.

I have a basic in-line fuel filter in place.

I have attached a copy of the build spec.

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Thanks for the comments on the mapping - i'll do my best to get the right answers but Im learning as I go and start from a very low knowledge point Im afraid, so at this stage don't actually understand what Im being asked - apologies.

I'll come back with more answers ASAP.

Thanks everyone.

Damian

[Allrounder]

So you not running a fuel pressure regulator! Then the pump will be delivering too much pressure. The MPi system uses a regulator on the fuel rail on the standard inlet manifold.

[Bat]

Hi,
It says nothing other than the standard setup. I'd assume he means there's an SPI throttle body on the car with the built in reg.
However I'm posting to ask about this too!
Let's assume for the moment SC have done the job he asked them to and mapped it correctly, the only thing that could screw it up is fuel pressure being too high.
We need to know how the fuel system is piped up and better still the actual fuel pressure.
Cheers

Edited by Bat, 26 June 2018 - 06:22 AM.

[Midas Mk1]

The sc kit should come with a fixed 3 bar reg that you put on the fuel rail by the tb, mounted mine on the relay bracket (with rubber mounts). IIrc its on the return.

Edited by Midas Mk1, 26 June 2018 - 06:56 AM.

[Foobah]

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Hi,

 

Thanks for the comments for far. 

 

What I have in place is as per the attached photo - hope this is helpful.

 

The white arrow shows fuel in. I have put the in-line filter in just as a precaution as the tank has been out and new fuel lines put in. 

 

SC needed an MPi fuel pump - but I don't have any other type of regulator in (aside from what might be in the SC kit) - I cannot trace the pressure it puts out (here's a link to the replacement item though - http://www.minispare...Back to search# - could this be the problem?)

I have attached a couple df other pics showing the plumbing in to and out of the injectors/inlet manifold.

 

Is a fuel pressure regulator needed in addition to what is already there? If it is, any advice on what/which type?

 

SC were just asked to provide a nice, drivable, fast road map.

 

Might be difficult to see, but Im hoping if anything is glaringly out of place in the photo, someone will spot it!

Attached Files

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Edited by Foobah, 26 June 2018 - 08:09 PM.

[Midas Mk1]

From the pics looks like you have the regulator on the inlet, pretty sure it goes on the return line to the tank. I'll check mine in a min..