15 replies to this topic

[ltdaigle]

So I'm trying to replace my standard hazard switch with a push button switch.  I've replaced the other switches on the dash but they are basically on off switches so it was fairly easy.  The hazard switch on the other hand is giving me some problems.  To start out I found out that if the switch isn't connected then my left or right indicators will not work.  I took the old switch apart and got some insight but still trying to figure out how to do it.  When the switch is off, the bottom two wires have connectivity which I'm assuming lets the indicators work.  When the switch is turned on, the top four wires have connectivity.  I think I can figure out how to wire the four top wires so that when the button is pushed that they will have connectivity but I don't think I can use this switch so that when is is in off that the other two wires have connectivity.  I was thinking maybe that I could install a relay with the two wires that would cause it to be closed when on and open when on but I don't know exactly how to make that work.  Any information will be greatly appreciated.

 

Attached Files

•  Hazard Switch front.jpg   20.18K   4 downloads
•  Hazard Switch rear.jpg   45.47K   3 downloads
•  Hazard1.jpg   11.76K   3 downloads
•  Hazard2.jpg   9.63K   2 downloads

[phillrulz]

From what i can see, the default switch, 

 

Two contact - connects flasher unit to the indicator stork , disconnects when hazards activated

 

Four contacts - Sends hazard flasher to lights and indicator lights. Normally disconnected. Connects when hazards on 

 

 

Not sure how you would switch it for that switch you have as the hazard output of the normal switch bypasses the indicator stork and connects to the lights. 

 

 

 

 

EDIT: Could use the hazard button to power a relay and use its contacts for the "hazard switch"?  Could do it with a standard DPDT automotive relay

Edited by phillrulz, 03 October 2017 - 07:47 PM.

[Spider]

You'll need to wiring it up using a 3 Pole Relay to use that switch.

[phillrulz]

You'll need to wiring it up using a 3 Pole Relay to use that switch.

Mr Moke, does it have to be 3 pin ? From the drawing i snapped, looks like the vertical line inside the existing switch is a short not just a link showing the contacts work in unison. Meaning a DPDT would work?

[Spider]

 

You'll need to wiring it up using a 3 Pole Relay to use that switch.

Mr Moke, does it have to be 3 pin ? From the drawing i snapped, looks like the vertical line inside the existing switch is a short not just a link showing the contacts work in unison. Meaning a DPDT would work?

 

 

If you were happy to only have them work with the key in ACC you could do it with a DPDT Relay, however they really need to work be able to work without the key at all, in which case, you need a 3PDT Relay. There maybe another way, possibly by using Diodes and a DPDT Relay. I'll put my thinking cap on.

The reason for the 3 poles is there's 3 circuits to be switched - Left Indicator, Right Indicator and Power (either via key or direct from battery).
The standard switch is 3 Pole for this reason.

Edited by Moke Spider, 03 October 2017 - 09:09 PM.

[Icey]

I've done this in ours. You use a DPDT and a SPDT relay to mimic the switch.
 
Edit:
 
Thinking about it, there was something odd about the DPDT relay I used - hang on, I'll look at my history and find what it was!
 
Edit2:
 
It wasn't the DPDT relay, it's the SP relay which is odd as it need to be SPDO (double output). This allows the hazard relay output to reach the two circuits when powered, but leaves the two circuits isolated when unpowered.
 
Edit3:
 
I'm going to go and take the dash off at this rate!
 
It's not a DPDT you need, it's an SPDT or SPNC (as long as one pole is closed when not powered). You then tie this up with the SPDO.
The SPNC connects the indicator relay to the direction switch (on the stalks). When the hazard switch is pressed this relay is activated, disconnecting the indicator relay.
Also connected to the hazard switch is the SPDO. This then connects both circuits (left and right) to the hazard relay.
You can take a feed for the hazard warning switch directly from either circuit (I have both as I have an L and R tell-tale).
 
Hopefully that finally makes sense!
 
 
Edit4:

Final one. Here are the parts.
You need one of these:
Polevolt - Relay 2795
 
And something like this:
Polevolt - Relay 2391

But anything will do for the second one, as long as at least one pole is NC.

And just for good measure, you can convert everything to relay controls if you want...I have:



All with push-buttons:

Edited by Icey, 03 October 2017 - 10:10 PM.

[Spider]

This is a schematic of how I add Hazards in to the Mokes

 

 

Where the switch is, if that's substituted with a 3PDT Relay and then power the relay coil via your switch, that;s one way it'll work.

 

< EDIT: The Switch I use by the way is the same as those fitted standard in the Minis for Hazards - same as that you are wanting to replace >

Edited by Moke Spider, 03 October 2017 - 10:11 PM.

[Spider]

Here's an option using a DPDT Relay and Diodes

 

[Icey]

Problem with diodes, Moke, is you have to have one that can deal with the forward current. I did look into it, but when I spotted the relay in my post above, it was just easier to use the two relays in tandem.

[Spider]

Problem with diodes, Moke, is you have to have one that can deal with the forward current. I did look into it, but when I spotted the relay in my post above, it was just easier to use the two relays in tandem.

 

Yes, I agree. I generally don't like using Diodes.

 

They need to be able to handle a Forward Current of just over 4 Amps.

 

Off hand, I think there's a 7 Amp type that's fairly readily available.

[ltdaigle]

Wow, thanks for all the input.  It's a little more in depth than I thought.  Hopefully I can figure out how to wire all this.   Icey, I think I'm gonna go your route.  What is the need for the two relays and if you don't mind, how would I connect them?

[phillrulz]

Ahhhhh i see where i went wrong, hense you said about diodes, without the diodes both indicators lives are shorted aka when you use an indicator it works as hazards and would light all the indicators at once. Thanks, 

[Icey]

Wow, thanks for all the input.  It's a little more in depth than I thought.  Hopefully I can figure out how to wire all this.   Icey, I think I'm gonna go your route.  What is the need for the two relays and if you don't mind, how would I connect them?

Moke's drawings show the general brake down of how the wiring works. I'd have to go back over the wiring diagrams to pick apart the colours. Give me some time and I'll have a go at putting something together.

[Spider]

 

Wow, thanks for all the input.  It's a little more in depth than I thought.  Hopefully I can figure out how to wire all this.   Icey, I think I'm gonna go your route.  What is the need for the two relays and if you don't mind, how would I connect them?

Moke's drawings show the general brake down of how the wiring works. I'd have to go back over the wiring diagrams to pick apart the colours. Give me some time and I'll have a go at putting something together.

 

 

You can also follow the first drawing I put up, but instead of a single 3P relay that I have suggested, a DPDT and a SPST Relay (so 2 relays).

Just another option,,,,,,

 

<EDIT: Here's a relay that will happily do the job   https://www.maplin.co.uk/p/4pdt-10a-power-relay-12dc-n10aw  >

Edited by Moke Spider, 05 October 2017 - 12:11 AM.

[ltdaigle]

So I got the switch installed with 2 relays and my signals work but my hazards don't.  It seems like they want to work but I'm thinking that they aren't getting enough power.  The switch lights up and I can hear the hazard switch click very slow and the LED on the switch go from bright to low and continue that but very slow and the hazards do not flash.  Am I thinking right about the power?  Any info would be great, thanks.