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Subframe Questions...


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#1 NunoTT

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Posted 12 December 2016 - 07:50 PM

Hello everyone!

 

I want to buy a pair of subframes (one front and one rear) for the Mini rebuild, but I have some questions...

 

-Are the rear subframes universal? Do they fit any "round" Mini, despite of the year?

 

-What front subframe do I need to fit an A-Series 1275 engine to my 1000 Mini? Are the engine mounts all in the same place? 

 

-What's the difference between a single bolt subframe and a twin bolt subframe, and how can I know which one I have?

 

-How can I know if the subframe I'm buying is for a dry or hydro suspension?

 

I hope I didn't forgot to ask anything  :lol:

 

Thanks in advance!!



#2 wile e coyote

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Posted 12 December 2016 - 08:53 PM

Ok -

There are two types of suspension used on the mini - hyrdrolastic - which its unlikely you have - fluid filled rubber displacers - easily spotted by the large pipes running front to rear.. or, dry - rubber "doughnut" - again easily spotted - look at your rear subframe - doughnuts on the end of alloy "trumpets"...... this is by far the most common set up now.....

 

All dry rear subframes are the same.... but genuine ones are to be preferred - generally they fit and align with no issues - but are expensive

 

Front subframes can have a twin bolt fitting or single - the twin bolts again are the older design - the single the more normal -  look below your wiper motor  to check...

 

There are sub variants of single bolt front subframe - one for automatic transmission - again easily determined!, another for the later injection cars (which mounts the engine a little further forward) and the "normal" one!! (all can be made to fit whatever application)

 

It's rare you have to buy a new front subframe - unless yours is damaged (i.e bent) as it's thick steel and the mini engine normally leaks protective oil all over it - so second hand is the cheaper option. Rear subframes however rot away readily so unless a good solid second hand one can be sourced - best to buy new.....



#3 NunoTT

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 07:29 AM

Thanks for the reply!

Everything is clear now!

The reason I'm buying nee subframes, is because I already have plans for my current subframes and engine. And I'm not going to buy new ones. I'm going to buy a used part abd rebuild them.

And just to be sure. If under my wiper motor I have two bolts, I have a twin bolt subframe, right?
Thanks again!!

#4 NunoTT

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 10:21 AM

Single bolt right?

#5 GraemeC

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 11:49 AM

If you have one large 15/16" AF bolt head then you have a single bolt front subframe

 

If you have 2 small, 1/2" AF nuts or bolt heads in front of the wiper motor then you have a twin bolt subframe.

If these two bolts have a hose between them, running through the cross member, then you have a hydrolastic (or hydro or wet) subframe, otherwise it is a dry.



#6 NunoTT

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 01:06 PM

If you have one large 15/16" AF bolt head then you have a single bolt front subframe
 
If you have 2 small, 1/2" AF nuts or bolt heads in front of the wiper motor then you have a twin bolt subframe.
If these two bolts have a hose between them, running through the cross member, then you have a hydrolastic (or hydro or wet) subframe, otherwise it is a dry.


Thanks! On the previous post where I asked "Single bolt, right?" I was suposed to attached a pic, but it didn't upload.
Looked under the bonnet and I have a single big bolt (24mm probably)(sorry, I'm in Portugal, so I use mm). So it means Inhaveba single bolt subframe.
Thank you very very much!!

#7 GraemeC

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 01:22 PM

24mm is a fraction larger than 15/16" so should fit - it will be a little loose so not 'ideal'

 

I would strongly suggest getting some imperial sockets and spanners, especially for sizes 3/8", 7/16", 1/2" and 9/16" - there is no substitute for the correct tools and you're much less likely to end up with rounded of nuts bolts and fingers!



#8 Dusky

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 03:15 PM

Its 34mm(well the Imperial equivalent) on the Big tower bolts though.

#9 THE ANORAK

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:32 PM

when rover launched the 1275cc coopers the engine was moved forward about an inch to give more clearance for the carb around the bulkhead. this maybe worth considering ???

 

also, didn't the rear subframe for the injection models have different exhaust mounts ????



#10 GraemeC

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:41 PM

Its 34mm(well the Imperial equivalent) on the Big tower bolts though.

 

You're correct - my own typing mistakes got the better of me.  The size is 1 5/16" (inch & five sixteenths)



#11 NunoTT

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 07:12 PM

Its 34mm(well the Imperial equivalent) on the Big tower bolts though.

 

Thansk for the correction. I thought it was 15/16" and not 1 5/16". I'll make sure I get a 1 5/16" socket to remove the bolts! By the way, do you know if I can get those bolt in metric instead of imperial?

 

24mm is a fraction larger than 15/16" so should fit - it will be a little loose so not 'ideal'

 

I would strongly suggest getting some imperial sockets and spanners, especially for sizes 3/8", 7/16", 1/2" and 9/16" - there is no substitute for the correct tools and you're much less likely to end up with rounded of nuts bolts and fingers!

 

Thanks! I already have some imperial sockets and spanners. I'll get a 1 5/16" socket to remove the bolts!

when rover launched the 1275cc coopers the engine was moved forward about an inch to give more clearance for the carb around the bulkhead. this maybe worth considering ???

 

also, didn't the rear subframe for the injection models have different exhaust mounts ????

I really don't want to move the engine forward, because I'll fit a 7-port head, so I need space in the front to mount the carbs. 

Thanks for the reply!



#12 Dusky

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Posted 13 December 2016 - 07:44 PM

You cant get them in metric, or would need to be Specialy Made . I must say that I used a 33 or 34 mm( think it was 33 mm) 6 sided socket before on All those bolts, so did my dad during his racing days and never had a problem. I know its bad practice and I eventualy bought the socket of minispares, bit never had rounded or damaged bolts and nuts.

#13 tiger99

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 01:40 AM

Some of the smaller, and more common, sizes are much more prone to damage. You can often get away with it in the larger sizes, as you have proved, although as you are saying, it s not good practice. But 3/8", 7/16", 1/2" and 9/16", those that you access every time you work on a Mini,  are not close enough to the nearest metric size and have a very high risk of damage.

 

To add to the misery of not having the correct tool sizes, some electrical items are likely to have BA threads and heads. Countries such as the USA are fully familiar with inch sizes, and increasingly, metric. Europe, almost exclusively metric, although those with older British vehicles or indeed any other British equipment will know about inch sizes. But who, outside the UK, has heard of BA?

 

On the other hand, I may be surprised because another ancient UK standard, BSP pipe threads, is in fact a worldwide standard for certain things. Indeed, it is the only standard for certain things. How that came about is one for the historians...

 

At least, with the exception of one thread form, not the hexagon, there are, as far as I have encountered, no BSW or BSF fixings on a Mini. Its predecessor the Moggy originally had quite a few.



#14 Spider

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 02:42 AM

 But who, outside the UK, has heard of BA?

 

I have and use it / work with it fairly often. I've a set of Open Ended and a Set of Ring Spanners as well as a few Spin-tights in O BA and 2 BA. I also have a set of Taps & Dies down to 12 BA.

 

The System is probably more widely known and popular than you may realise.



#15 tiger99

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 11:46 AM

I knew that you would be well equipped for obvious reasons! But what about the garage down the road who only fixes modern Australian, German and Japanese cars?




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