29 replies to this topic

[ozz1]

Wondering what the real consensus is... 
 
My engine has no thrust washer locaters because the centre cap has been milled flat. I've posted previously asking possible solutions which may help explain my drift  - http://www.theminifo...s/#entry3431624
 
 
Where is the evidence to back up the claims made on various forums?
 

Edited by ozz1, 26 November 2016 - 03:18 PM.

[gazza82]

Surely without the locating slots for the tabs the washers will spin with the crank .. or will they until the tabs hit something solid?

[Cooperman]

On the Triumph 2000 engine, it was not unknown for the thrust washers to 'spin' once they became a bit work.

The solution was to drill the caps in 2 positions on each side and drill and countersink the thrust washers to take silver-steel dowels with a light push fit into the caps.

 

The thrust washers MUST NOT be allowed to spin freely.

[gazza82]

I had a 2.5 .. spinning thrust washers meant the crank had to be welded and recut to build the face back up ....

Edited by gazza82, 25 November 2016 - 07:25 PM.

[tiger99]

I agree. The lesser Triumphs had a similar problem. One common fix was to drill and countersink the locating tab and drill and tap the block, and fit a countersunk screw (6BA in those days, say M3 now) with plenty of Loctite. That should still work even if there is no locating notch. However you most likely need to locate the bearing at two or more places so I would suggest also applying Cooperman's suggestion, so there would be a dowel at each end of the C shaped bearing and a screw in the tab.

 

I worry about the people who said it was not necessary, and the engines they produce.

[OzOAP]

 
I worry about the people who said it was not necessary, and the engines they produce.

You do not know what you are talking about.
998s with 'floating' thrust washers are no problem what so ever. They do not spin freely.
I have just looked through my engine build book and have done over 50 998s with caps modified in this way.
This thread is also typical of modern day keyboard warriors and experts.
Also if Ian, who built the engine, and I, engine supplyer to 7 mini 7 champions, say its ok, why then continue to ask the question to forum 'experts'?

Edited by OzOAP, 26 November 2016 - 01:53 PM.

[tiger99]

The point is that if the cap and block really have been machined flat, there is NOTHING to prevent the washers falling out.

[OzOAP]

Where and why would the block be machined flat? How do you fit 998 centre main straps?

[Midas Mk1]

Take no notice of tiger99 Oz, he's the forum joker which gives everyone a good laugh at.

[tiger99]

You guys can't read. The OP said that it was milled flat.

[ozz1]

 
I worry about the people who said it was not necessary, and the engines they produce.

You do not know what you are talking about.
998s with 'floating' thrust washers are no problem what so ever. They do not spin freely.
I have just looked through my engine build book and have done over 50 998s with caps modified in this way.
This thread is also typical of modern day keyboard warriors and experts.
Also if Ian, who built the engine, and I, engine supplyer to 7 mini 7 champions, say its ok, why then continue to ask the question to forum 'experts'?

I was interested if anyone has had any actual experience of failure...or if many other people do it the same way with no problems. Can't blame me for wanting to be totally sure!

Thank you for your input. I will be leaving it as is

[tiger99]

By the way, even if the thrust washers are located reliably but are free to rotate, the steel backing rotates against the cast iron block, not a suitable combination for the load involved, and soon the end float is increasing, metal particles are entering the oil, and quite probably a spectacular failure occurs soon after, when sufficient clearance has developed for the washer halves to be ejected.

And Midas Mk1 appears to be one of those who like to disagree with my factually correct and provably so observations on safety related problems. That attitude will come back to bite people. It always does, regardless of myself being involved.

[OzOAP]

The wonderful, unproven ramblings of some people is so entertaining.

[Midas Mk1]

Oz, it's hilarious isn't it. In all of his comments he always criticises and never shows any of his own work, cars..

It's keyboard warriors like him that tarnish this forums name, he wouldn't dare say the stuff he does in person. Not all of us are like this.

You don't get your record with race engines for nothing, and for someone to dirspect your free knowledge and advice, well that's just plain rude. Hence why I commented and challenged this dreamer.

[OzOAP]

I only replied to the thread as the OP bought me into it. Then to be slated by nobodys makes my piss boil....!
I now see the original post has been edited removing Ian and my name.

Edited by OzOAP, 26 November 2016 - 07:17 PM.