14 replies to this topic

[myminipickup]

Hello. 

 

I guess this has been asked many times, but I can't really find the answer.

 

I have a Mini Pickup with a 1000cc engine and a  magic wand gearbox. It currently has 10inch wheels. I have just bought a 1275 complete engine and gearbox from a 1990s Cooper with the intention of putting it into My Pickup. 

 

But, if I can help it, I don't want to cut a hole in the floor for the remote and use the Magic wand - I have seen the Guess Works gearbox - (http://www.guess-wor.../NewProduct.htm) , but this is quite expensive considering I have both gearboxes.

 

Does anyone know if I can somehow swap the magic wand part of the gearbox _ perhaps with some machining or something??? Vague I know!

 

Also how would the new gearbox with the final drive of 3.21 mess up the speedo/mileage/acceleration/etc compared to the original final drive of 3.444? Or can I also swap the final drive from the magic wand gearbox to the 1275 gearbox!?!?

 

Thank you for your help

 

[Spider]

If your Magic Wand Gearbox is an Ally Synchro Box, the 1275 engine will fit straight on to it, no worries, the only thing that springs to mind that's you'd need is a Primary Gear to suit the 1275 crankshaft. IMO, given what you are wanting to achieve, this could be you're easiest way forward as the Magic Wand type Gearboxes are based on Remote Types, where as the Gearbox from the 1990 Cooper will be a Rod Shift type, these don't convert to Magic Wand unless you change the whole Gearbox case, by which time, you would be better off with the magic Wand you have.

 

However, while I haven't done it, there is a possibility that you can use the Rod Shift Gearbox, you'd have to check this for yourself. Bear with me on this.

 

Our Mokes were fitted with the Magic Wand gearboxes, same as your Pick-up, up to 74, when they went to the Rod Shift. They never changed to size nor location of the Hole in the floor for the Shifter, but they did add some mounts under the floor. The Rods on the Shifters used were quite short when compared to those used in a Mini. I can't see hwy this wouldn't work in a Mini, but I stress, i haven't done it, so I don't know for sure.

 

Here the various Shifters side by side;-

 

 

The vary top one was fitted to the very late Mokes, which did have the hole in the floor relocated, so ignore that one.

 

The next one down, in the middle is the one to which I'm referring.

 

The bottom one of course is the stock Mini one.

 

I've of no doubt, that should this all line up, you can shorten the Rods from a Mini Shifter to do the job. You would have to make up a mount but that's fairly straight forward, you can sorta see the mount that's on this one.

 

<Edit: You'd also have to extend and bend the shift lever, but again, no big deal. >

Edited by Moke Spider, 31 July 2016 - 09:49 PM.

[myminipickup]

If your Magic Wand Gearbox is an Ally Synchro Box, the 1275 engine will fit straight on to it, no worries, the only thing that springs to mind that's you'd need is a Primary Gear to suit the 1275 crankshaft. IMO, given what you are wanting to achieve, this could be you're easiest way forward as the Magic Wand type Gearboxes are based on Remote Types, where as the Gearbox from the 1990 Cooper will be a Rod Shift type, these don't convert to Magic Wand unless you change the whole Gearbox case, by which time, you would be better off with the magic Wand you have.

 

However, while I haven't done it, there is a possibility that you can use the Rod Shift Gearbox, you'd have to check this for yourself. Bear with me on this.

 

Our Mokes were fitted with the Magic Wand gearboxes, same as your Pick-up, up to 74, when they went to the Rod Shift. They never changed to size nor location of the Hole in the floor for the Shifter, but they did add some mounts under the floor. The Rods on the Shifters used were quite short when compared to those used in a Mini. I can't see hwy this wouldn't work in a Mini, but I stress, i haven't done it, so I don't know for sure.

 

Here the various Shifters side by side;-

 

 

The vary top one was fitted to the very late Mokes, which did have the hole in the floor relocated, so ignore that one.

 

The next one down, in the middle is the one to which I'm referring.

 

The bottom one of course is the stock Mini one.

 

I've of no doubt, that should this all line up, you can shorten the Rods from a Mini Shifter to do the job. You would have to make up a mount but that's fairly straight forward, you can sorta see the mount that's on this one.

 

<Edit: You'd also have to extend and bend the shift lever, but again, no big deal. >

 

 

Thank you for this -  - great idea -  I will take a look, see if a shorter rod shift will fit under the floor - am not sure how much room there is under the floor by the existing hole. 

 

I don't think the original gearbox will fit onto the 1275 - from what I know, its a 3 synchro and I believe that the casing will foul - but this may be wrong 

 

EDIT: I think I am wrong on this - from what I have just read it will probably be a 4 synchro box  - So would this fit directly onto the 1275 engine???

 

 

Edited by myminipickup, 31 July 2016 - 10:15 PM.

[minisprint]

Never seen a shortened rod change shifter interesting

[Spider]

 I don't think the original gearbox will fit onto the 1275 - from what I know, its a 3 synchro and I believe that the casing will foul - but this may be wrong.

 

 

 

All still may not be lost. There were some 3 Synchro Gear cases that will fit under a 1275. If you look on the gearbox casing, behind the Oil Filter, there's some numbers cast in to the Gearbox, see what they are.

 

Though, you'd be stuck with e 3 synchro box

[nicklouse]

Don't forget that there was the old internal change kit was was available for the magic wand so you could fit the rod box with an internal shift kit without it looking like it was out of place.

[myminipickup]

Don't forget that there was the old internal change kit was was available for the magic wand so you could fit the rod box with an internal shift kit without it looking like it was out of place.

 

you mean something like this: http://www.kentautod...ear-linkage-kit

 

??

[nicklouse]

that type of idea.

 

google SPQR gear linkage extender for the original kit to bring the magic want box shifter towards the seats.

Edited by nicklouse, 01 August 2016 - 08:40 AM.

[myminipickup]

 

 I don't think the original gearbox will fit onto the 1275 - from what I know, its a 3 synchro and I believe that the casing will foul - but this may be wrong.

 

 

 

All still may not be lost. There were some 3 Synchro Gear cases that will fit under a 1275. If you look on the gearbox casing, behind the Oil Filter, there's some numbers cast in to the Gearbox, see what they are.

 

Though, you'd be stuck with e 3 synchro box

 

 

 

Ok - Thanks - I will take a look - what do the numbers refer to?

[Spider]

 

EDIT: I think I am wrong on this - from what I have just read it will probably be a 4 synchro box  - So would this fit directly onto the 1275 engine???

 

 

 

Yes.

 

I have had the odd one and it's rare, that need a touch with a file where the main cap bolts are at the flywheel end, but these are very rare.

 

<EDIT: History lesson from the factory on the design philosophy when the all synchro box was introduced (the reference to the Mini K was an 1100 engined Mini)

 

 

>

Edited by Moke Spider, 02 August 2016 - 11:04 AM.

[myminipickup]

 

 

EDIT: I think I am wrong on this - from what I have just read it will probably be a 4 synchro box  - So would this fit directly onto the 1275 engine???

 

 

 

Yes.

 

I have had the odd one and it's rare, that need a touch with a file where the main cap bolts are at the flywheel end, but these are very rare.

 

<EDIT: History lesson from the factory on the design philosophy when the all synchro box was introduced (the reference to the Mini K was an 1100 engined Mini)

 

 

>

 

 

 

I saw this on Somerford Mini website:

 

 

 

     

Direct gearchange (where the gearlever disappears through the toeboard straight into the back of the gearbox) was the system the Mini started with back in 1959.  Its fitment was interspersed with the remote gearchange system (where the gearlever emerged from the end of a long aluminium casting under the floor) through the 1960s to the early 1970s - by rule of thumb, more upmarket Minis got the remote gearchange while more basic models (i.e. lowly 850s) carried on with the direct version.  Calling it 'direct' was probably a bit of a misnomer, as the nicknames of 'Magic Wand' and 'Pudding Stirrer' hinted that in practice changing gear was not always that direct...

While the direct and remote change systems are very obviously totally different, they share the same gear selector mechanism inside the gearbox.  From late 1968 when the gearbox went over from 3 to 4 synchromesh, they shared the same differential housing too - prior to that, the direct gearchange had its own unique diff housing with a small gearchange tower on it.

The later rod change system (see the next section for details) required a complete redesign of the gear selector mechanism.  Saloons and Estates were re-engineered for rod gearchange for the 1973 model year.  Vans and Pick Ups however did not lose their direct gearchange in favour of rod change until the end of 1975.

 

I assume that this means that my 1972 pickup has a 4 synchro magic wand gearbox... If this is the case, will it fit on the 1990s 1275? would it be strong enough to cope with the 1275 power?  I guess I need to take it apart to confirm!?

Edited by myminipickup, 02 August 2016 - 11:17 AM.

[Spider]

 

I assume that this means that my 1972 pickup has a 4 synchro magic wand gearbox... If this is the case, will it fit on the 1990s 1275? would it be strong enough to cope with the 1275 power?  I guess I need to take it apart to confirm!?

 

 

Yes and Yes.

 

To be quite sure on these points, can you come back with the Gearbox Casing Number as cast in to the Gearbox? They are fairly easy to read, though you may need a Mirror and like start with something like 22GXXXX. The numbers are behind the (Engine) Oil Filter, on the gearbox case.

 

<EDIT: It will almost certain be the same gearbox as fitted to our 'Export' model Mokes, manufactured between 1971 and 1973, fitted with 1275 engines. >

Edited by Moke Spider, 02 August 2016 - 11:34 AM.

[Cooperman]

I have fitted an A+ block, crank & piston assembly onto a 3-syncro remote change box which I believe is internally the same dimensions as a 3-syncro 'wand-type' box.

To do this I had to remove quite a lot of metal from the top inside edges of the box and had to do many trial fits in order to obtain clearance for the big-ends. Care must be taken to avoid removing too much metal and thus making the casing too weak. It is not recommended, but can be done.

[whistler]

I have fitted an A+ block, crank & piston assembly onto a 3-syncro remote change box which I believe is internally the same dimensions as a 3-syncro 'wand-type' box.

To do this I had to remove quite a lot of metal from the top inside edges of the box and had to do many trial fits in order to obtain clearance for the big-ends. Care must be taken to avoid removing too much metal and thus making the casing too weak. It is not recommended, but can be done.

I did similar when I built a 1275GT motor onto an 850 box (around 1972) to which I fitted S/C gears (3 Synchro). My 850 box was circa 1963 and I had to grind a lot of aluminium as Cooperman said to allow the 1275 crank to fully rotate. Worked a treat, still with the magic wand fitted.

[myminipickup]

Thank you for your help.  I will check the numbers as Moke Spider has suggested - it may be a couple of days until I can get to it.