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Low Compression


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#1 Andrew22-10

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 05:35 PM

I recently fitted a new head gasket to my 93 1275 Italian job mini, the replacement went smoothly up until the point were i went to start the engine. it started first time for about 10 seconds then died and wouldn't start again. there is a good a spark at all spark plugs and it is getting fuel into the cylinders the only issue that i can see is the compression being a bit low (ranging from 85-95psi). the valves are all seated properly and are not leaking, the tappets have all been set to 0.30mm. i have no idea what else the issue could be.

 

I have tried putting a bit of engine oil in the cylinders and then repeated the compression test and it made no difference.

 

if anyone has any suggestions it would be appreciated. 

 



#2 carbon

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Posted 07 April 2016 - 08:33 PM

Do you know for sure that the compression tester is OK, and you've done measurement with throttle open?

 

85 to 95 psi is very low. The last 1275 engine I took apart had this reading on a couple of cylinders, but bores were totally goosed and the top piston rings were all broken into little pieces.



#3 Andrew22-10

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Posted 08 April 2016 - 02:07 PM

yeah the bores and rings where fine and the tester is fine because i tested it on my dads old motorbike and it worked fine. would the compression cause it to not start because i was thinking it could be ignition timing.



#4 sonikk4

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Posted 08 April 2016 - 04:04 PM

If you put oil into the bores and there was no increase then that points to a valve seating issue. Double check your tappets again to make sure they are spot on. Those figures are way too low.



#5 Andrew22-10

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 09:06 AM

i have checked the valve seats twice now. before i put the valves back in i ground them in with a fine grinding paste.



#6 ACDodd

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 09:12 AM

Did you reset the valve clearances after changing the gasket?
Perform a leakdown test to determine if the ring and valves are good. Uf they are it indicates a valve timing issue.

Ac

#7 Andrew22-10

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 02:46 PM

i reset the valve clearances after the gasket was done. how do i do a leak down test?

 

The think that i dont understand is that it started for a few seconds when i first did the gasket, it stopped and hasnt wanted to start since (january ish)

 

(It has electronic ignition i that helps)



#8 Alpenflitzer

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 03:11 PM

The correct way to do it is with the engine at proper operating temperature (80 Grad C)with the throttle wide open

 

Do you use a screw-in tester? All sparks out? Throttle fully open?

 

A teaspoon of oil in the cylinder to be tested should improve pressure.

If not --->valve problem or gasket problem.

 

Here an extract from a magazine:

  • If there is any serious variation, you can try a few other tricks to attempt to discover the cause

o    First, set your valve clearances (12 thou cold), then retest

o    Second, run the test with all of the spark plugs removed -- if there is a drastic difference          between plugs in and plugs out, you may have a gasket blown between cylinder

o    Third, if one or more cylinders is lower than the others try squirting a bit of oil (no more than a teaspoon) into the cylinder and retesting, if the pressure increases you may need new rings, if it stays low it may be a gasket, a sticky or burnt valve or a poorly seating valve

  • Other things to look for are bubbles in the coolant while running (take off the radiator cap, top up the coolant, start the car and watch for bubbles. A few is normal, and the car may eventually bump some coolant out when it warms up fully, also normal
  • A steady stream of bubbles or dropping coolant level are signs of a bad gasket or cracked head
  • Also, check for oil in the coolant (black floating globs) or coolant in the oil (pop the oil fill cap off and look for white, milky goop, a little is to be expected from condensation, a lot is bad)

Compression testing and ratios

A compression gauge tells you what pressure it sees in the combustion chamber when the engine is being driven by the starter motor.

The first problem is that compression gauges are not precision devices nor are they intended to be. They are only good for relative measurements.

A good way to test a compression gauge is to measure the same cylinder several times over a period of time and see how the measurements change. Second, a cold engine, driven by a starter motor isn't a great approximation of an operating engine. The cam can have large effects on the numbers as can the cranking speed. This is why using a compression gauge to estimate compression ratio is likely to be inaccurate.

However, one table of CR and pressures comes with the following warning: "Just to satisfy the reader's curiosity, below is a table showing the approximate relationship between compression ratio and compression pressure at cranking speeds. However, even if a table such as this could be trusted, there is the question of gauge accuracy." (Motor's Auto Engines and Electrical Systems c.1970)


Edited by Alpenflitzer, 09 April 2016 - 03:13 PM.


#9 Andrew22-10

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 03:38 PM

thanks i have tryed putting oil in the cyilinders and it made no difference. I find it hard to beleive that it could be rings because i have never heard of all rings going at that same time. the valves were in good condition and were ground in to form a good seal, i then flipped the head and filled the seats with petrol and there were no leaks. the head was skimmed by an engineering company before the valves were done. 

 

I am totally out of ideas now and i appreciated the help everyone has given. i rlly want to get it running because i hate seeing it sitting in the garage not moving and leeking oil but that is another issue.



#10 Carlos W

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 09:31 PM

Did you use the rule of 9 when setting tappets?

#11 Andrew22-10

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Posted 09 April 2016 - 11:50 PM

yes (when number 1 tappet is full down set 8 ect)






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