Speeding Along Now
Posted 08 November 2015 - 03:16 PM
I have been looking to refit the spring and ball bearing back into my A+ block oil pressure relief orifice and was not sure if the seat was still inside? There is a concave shaped piece with a hole in the area where the ball will sit, is this the seat?
Andy.
Super Mini Mad
Posted 08 November 2015 - 03:42 PM
Speeding Along Now
Posted 08 November 2015 - 04:42 PM
I have removed the old bullet shaped valve already before the block was chemically cleaned.
Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011
Posted 08 November 2015 - 05:36 PM
The bullet-shaped plunger is way better than a ball.
One Carb Or Two?
Posted 08 November 2015 - 06:29 PM
I read this question as he wanted to know if the seating is in the block.
I find that there's little difference in how it looks whether the seat is in or not. Really need to measure down and compare with a block that definitely has one in.
Moved Into The Garage
Posted 08 November 2015 - 06:37 PM
I read this question as he wanted to know if the seating is in the block.
I find that there's little difference in how it looks whether the seat is in or not. Really need to measure down and compare with a block that definitely has one in.
That is one good way.
Another is if the Main Gallery Oil Plugs have been pulled (and they should be for chemical cleaning), if you put a torch light up to the Main Galley, you won't see any light when looking through the Oil Feed to No. 3 Main Bearing if the Seat is still fitted, but you'll clearly see the light if it's out.
<Edit: Yet another is to offer up a stock relief valve bucket and spring. It the spring hangs out of the block about 10 mm then the seat is there, if the spring disappears inside the hole, then the seat is out. >
Edited by Moke Spider, 08 November 2015 - 06:40 PM.
Speeding Along Now
Posted 08 November 2015 - 06:55 PM
unfortunately the engine is built up so the torch thing won't work, I have put the spring and ball and the old bullet cap in with its old spring and they both stick out 15-20 mm.
Andy.
Moved Into The Garage
Posted 08 November 2015 - 07:00 PM
The seat is in there then.
I would strong advise (as the other guys have also) against fitting a ball. It's not the right shape and won't regulate the pressure correctly.
Edited by Moke Spider, 08 November 2015 - 07:00 PM.
Up Into Fourth
Posted 08 November 2015 - 07:22 PM
+1 for avoiding ball and spring as replacement for std pressure relief valve.
I used one for 6 months, was fine in warm weather. Once winter kicked in the oil pressure at cold start was well over 100psi. One cold morning I reckon it hit about 120-130psi (full dial gauge, right round and keeping going).
Not quite sure what max pressure was, but had the effect of blowing out oil gallery plug at flywheel end. Engine out job to replace the gallery plug.
Standard oil relief plunger refitted, no problems since.
Speeding Along Now
Posted 08 November 2015 - 08:22 PM
Ah I bought the ball after reading the calver articles, my bullet thing has some heavy scores down it, will I get away with wet and drying the old one or will it affect the pressure to much?
Andy.
Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011
Posted 08 November 2015 - 09:25 PM
Just polish the scores out of it, check that it slides cleanly and fit it.
Moved Into The Garage
Posted 08 November 2015 - 10:17 PM
Ah I bought the ball after reading the calver articles, my bullet thing has some heavy scores down it, will I get away with wet and drying the old one or will it affect the pressure to much?
Andy.
I'd suggest replacing it.
They are a neat fit in the bore that they slide in and they need some length on them that will not pass undue amounts of oil down past the bucket. This is so you can get a pressure difference across the valve and this is why the ball is a fail. Without a reasonable pressure difference the valve won't move and so the pressure will be sky high (as Carbon found).
On top of that, they don't cost much at all.
Passed Test
Posted 10 November 2015 - 09:06 AM
I've gone down the route of fitting a ball relief whilst re-working an auto block to make it 'manual'. Hey presto, I too have 120 psi on cranking, admittedly without shortening the spring.
I've read that cutting 3 coils off will reduce the pressure to something manageable, but reading this thread I'm considering a return to the original plunger...
Two questions:
If cutting the 'Cooper S' spring is necessary, how did the original fitment work with that spring and ball and not create 120 psi?
How do I get the flippin' ball out? Will oil flow from cranking the engine pop it?
Super Mini Mad
Posted 10 November 2015 - 09:14 AM
a slim magnet.. I use an old one from a top hat contact ADI Global part FC503/WH/G2/B
Moved Into The Garage
Posted 10 November 2015 - 09:18 AM
Sorry, not to undermine your handy work, but just checking that you have replace the seat on the conversion? The Auto and Manual ones are different and leaving the Auto one in, while it will work, it also sends unfiltered Oil down to No, 3 Main Bearing.
OK, now back to the topic at hand, as the ball is bigger in diameter than the thickness of the spring seat with a stock set up, it is normal to need to shorten the spring by some amount, how much? Well it's not really as straight forward as measure it all because they ball is a different shape to the original bucket it will behave differently under hydraulic conditions (not withstanding the down sides mentioned above). Also, if you look through a hydraulic parts book, you'll quickly see that none of the flow control devices listed have a ball shape to them.
Oil flow from cranking will push the ball out, or use a magnet as David has suggested ^.
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