15 replies to this topic

[jetmechinnc]

I just purchased my first classic mini, 1976 mini 1000 R/H drive. It doesn't have a horn installed, former owner said he bought it without it from a friend. I have found at least one wire connector for it, purple with black stripe. Would this be the horn as seen at mini mania "single connector" one? Per the wiring diagram though, all minis listed, it should have a purple black and purple wire. Also, The turn signals do not work, the former owner just said they were intermitting. Per my little Leyland manual, it says unit is in the fascia parcel shelf, does that mean under the dash?

Any help will be appreciated

Jason

 

[lrostoke]

quick look at wiring diagrams around that year, show just the one wire, purple/black with the horn earthing through the body of the car.

 

your looking for a flasher unit should be 2 connections green and light green/brown normally a silver looking object look around the steering column

[jetmechinnc]

Thank you for the info on the horn.  I'll try to find a used or remake of one that is all metal.  Otherwise I guess I'll need a ground wire.  Odd my service manual shows two wires.  Still no luck on that relay.  The relay for the hazard lights is a different one yes?  I found that one on the fwd firewall L/H side next to the windshield washer fluid bottle.  Would the relay be behind the dash, cardboard wall,  L/H or R/H side?  Only real wire bundles I see are at the steering wheel but with no relays, just wire connections.  There is a rectangle box connected to the the structure of the brake pedal.  Is that it?  I was thinking this may be for the brake lights.  Maybe I'm wrong.  Suggestions?

[Gremlin]

The 'relay' on the fwd of the firewall is for the hazards/4 ways, and the box on the brake pedal structure is indeed for the brake lights, the 'relay' for the turn signals is behind the dash/cardboard wall on the right hand side

[dklawson]

Where are you?  I am in Durham.  My full contact information should be under my profile at Mini Mania... same user name.

 

The original Lucas flashers may or may not work properly.  You have to have the correct wattage bulbs for them to behave as designed.  Though not original you can substitute the more common Tridon EL12 flashers available at local parts stores.  The wire on the Lucas "L" terminal goes to the "L" terminal on the Tridon flasher and the other wire goes on whatever that terminal is labeled (its letter designation is different between Lucas and Tridon).  The Tridon unit is electronic and does not care what wattage bulbs you use.  The downside is that being electronic and wattage insensitive, if you burn out a bulb, the flash rate will not change with the Tridon unit.  (Early cars like mine do not have hazard lights and use a 3 terminal flasher for which you can substitute the Tridon EL13).

 

As mentioned above, the horn circuit works differently than most others on the car.  The horn circuit is "hot" all the time with the horn button providing a ground connection when the button is pushed.  Early cars did not use a horn relay while later cars did.  If you are sorting out problems with the horn circuit, consider adding a horn relay if none is present.  It takes the load off the wiring in the steering column and the horn pushbutton which makes both last longer.  The standard Bosch/ISO headlamp relay at most parts stores is perfect for the task.  These relays are also available very economically on eBay in packs of 5 or 10 complete with pre-wired bases.  

[jetmechinnc]

Where are you?  I am in Durham.  My full contact information should be under my profile at Mini Mania... same user name.

 

I'm in Winston Salem NC and work out at the Greensboro airport.  I have a 2010 mini I'm taking up to VIR monday for my time with Phil Wicks while the "new" old mini is at Sneed's Speed shop getting a bit of body work done.  When I get hime back, I'll figure out this turn signal issue.  Already ordered a relay from 7 enterprise, now I just need to find it.  Should be no problems taking out the cardboard dash.  As well as testing the wire and buying a horn.  I see 7 enterprise sells a high note and a low note horn, is one better than the other or do most people join them together in series or parallel?

[dklawson]

Winston-Salem is a nice place.  I have visited there a couple of times but these days seldom get further west than Greensboro.

 

I have seen Phil on the track.  His vintage Mini often runs in the same class as my father-in-law's Formula-Vee.  They were last on the track together at the Gold Cup race at VIR in September.  Sadly, Phil was the only Mini there.

 

Horns are wired in parallel.  To the best of my knowledge the Mini came stock with only one horn, at least back when your car was made.  I don't know if they installed the low or the high horn when only one is used.  Our Triumphs have twin horns and the high and low notes sound great together.  

 

I really don't know where the flasher is on a '76.  On early cars like mine they are in the engine bay which is not the best place for them.  They are subjected to a harsh environment AND you cannot hear them clicking to remind you that you were an idiot and left your turn signals on.  I went so far as to wire an "open door" chime from an Alfa into my turn signal circuit so I would hear something to remind me to turn the signal off.

[KernowCooper]

My mk4 has the flasher unit to the right of the carb on the firewall when viewed from the front, the hazard unit is also there.

[jetmechinnc]

My mk4 has the flasher unit to the right of the carb on the firewall when viewed from the front, the hazard unit is also there.

Found the relay, with my voltmeter,  it was next to the hazard one on the firewall, a small square unit.  Not like any other I've seen at either auto parts store or parts websites, they were always a barrel.  Did verify the possible problem though, only getting 9.8 volts to the relay, it needs between 11-15 volts, at least the new one I bought does.  Must have either corrosion in the wires, or a splice from somebody doing crappy work draining some voltage.  Guess I'll have to turn everything back to OEM and see if I can't get my voltage back up there.  Every other relay works, except maybe the wiper blades, they either work or they don't as well.  Will get time soon enough to figure it out if I ever get the use of my garage again from my tenant.  

[dklawson]

You should be able to go to Advance or AutoZone and get the round, 2-prong Triden EL-12 flasher and use it.  The terminals are marked differently than the Lucas unit but both will have an "L" terminal.  Make sure you put the right wire on the "L" terminal and the remaining wire goes on the remaining terminal regardless of what Triden labeled it.

 

The wiper issue may be the connector on the motor or the switch itself... or the main supply to the switch and motor. What exactly is the wiper motor doing?  Does it simply work or not work or does it have problems like one speed works and the other doesn't... or it won't return to the park position?

[jetmechinnc]

The wiper motors basically either work, or they don't.  and some times they don't return to the parked position.  I had a fit trying to get them back there.  When they work, the speed switch does work.  They just don't seem to want to work all of the time.  I'll see which flasher unit I bought, I know its a 2 prong one, just not sure on the EL-12 part.  It just said it was for turn signals and extra loud blinking noise.  Gonna have to find the voltage drop problem first though.

[dklawson]

The EL-12 flasher is electronic and will switch on and off at a constant rate regardless of the bulb Wattage and/or whether bulbs are burned out.  Some don't like that last part as you will not get an indication (by flash rate) of when a bulb needs replacing.  This does not bother me.

 

Based on the symptoms you are describing I would look for problems with the main power and ground for the wiper motor.  It sounds like the switch itself is working.  The auto-park function involves a loop-back of main power through the park switch on the motor to the low-speed circuit.  Since it sounds like park is as intermittent as normal running, that hints at the 12V or earth supply lines.

[jetmechinnc]

Something I did find out wrong with the electrical system so far is the main battery cable was chaffed about 1/4 thru due to a rusted out adele clamp just aft of the exhaust/ engine under the car.  Unfortunately, I ordered a new one from mini mania and I got an email from them saying they have non in stock, but I should get it in 1-2 weeks.  Should have stuck with mini spares.  Oh well,  but the wire sure did make a bright flash when I moved it LOL!  Was just looking under the car for problems and I thought it was a hydraulic line or something and they POP, bright light!  

[dklawson]

An alternative is to split a piece of large ID fuel hose and place it over the damaged part of the old cable and make your own clamp to secure the patched cable so it is less likely to get damaged in the future.

 

If you are not comfortable repairing the insulation (and rest assured there are many Minis with patched main battery leads), you can make your own cable if you don't want to wait on Mini Mania.  You can use either marine or welding cable which should be available locally.  #4 AWG cable will easily fit the track on the bottom of the floorpan, #2 AWG will fit with a bit of work and has the advantage of much more copper.  If you don't have a local marine or welding supply you can order the cable from McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com).  Just go to their web site and type "welding cable" in the FIND field.  They will sell to anyone with a charge card and they have both red and black cable available.  Terminals for this bulk cable will be available both on the McMaster web site and at your local parts house.  

 

It is a bit of work to make your own cable.  However, the loose terminals and bulk cable (approximately 11 feet) will be less expensive than the $60 Mini Mania charges for the main battery cable.

[jetmechinnc]

Well, I got the battery cable replaced, only had about 4 wire threads left.  Plus I guess it was all just corrosion for the turn signals, seems after removing and checking wires, as well as the 4 fuses and installing a new flasher unit, the turn signals and wiper motors work just fine, thankfully.  Now I just have to figure out were is the problem with the horn.  Checking at the horn plugin connection, I have no power, nor ground with or without pushing in the horn button.  Have an open somewhere, not sure where yet.  But at least everything else electrical seems to work, even the rear defrosters, got to use them last night coming home from work, yay.