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Overheating Problem

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Best Answer Captain Mainwaring , 07 August 2013 - 01:45 AM

Hey guys, just a quick one: I took he mini for a short drive yesterday and then I took the rad cap off and put a temp sensor in the top of the rad, the temp read 90 degrees and the gauge inside the car was just below he red line. my question is: what is the normal running temp?

 

 

You shouldn't have taken the cap off, though in this case it doesn't matter, the car wasn't boiling. You have however answered your own question and solved your own problem - a car isn't in the red at 90C :-)

 

anything between 82 and 92 degs is quite normal temp

in the cylinder head temp will be slightly higher, so i'd expect the gauge reading a bit higher, when temp outside gets above 30° minis tend to run quite hot, but if temp goes quickly above 95-98 degs while driving, then you have a problem somewhere

 

Well not really once you are above the stat opening temperature. 

The circ water temp will increase once the balancing point of the cooling system is reached - given a certain ambient temp with the engine under a certain operating condition, the circ cooling water temp will increase until their is sufficient differential in the circ water temp and the ambient air temp to effect a change in the heat balance and allow heat energy to flow from the cooling system to the surrounding air. Heat transfer is expressed as W/(mK) so a cooling system water/air will loose 1/(273+new ambient temp-original ambient temp) *100% efficiency for a given change - it won't suddenly get worse at 30C.

 

I don't  reckon an engine is excessively hot at 90C and the gauge certainly shouldn't be in the red - unfortunately these are hardly calibrated instrumentation and I think there may be a huge difference between calibration of gauge head units and PT100's (i'm guessing that they are 100's)

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#31 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 05:45 AM

 

 

 

Certainly good advice - but don't mess around borrowing one - just buy a new one. Also check the seat inside the cap.....You can pressure test a system by filling it up and the putting a footpump on the rad overflow and clamping the schrader shut over it - it's close enough to hold pressure.

 

 

Bring it up to 15 to 20 psi and leave it...see what happens.

 

 

 

LOL Classic.............

 

 

What's "LOL Classic"? - it works - it's an easy way of pressurizing a cooling system - moreover the cap has a NRV/vacuum breaker built in so it can be left under pressure.

 

Have you nothing better to add to the discussion? Nearly 3500 posts and this is the best comment you can make?

Please don't derail a thread where an OP is looking for advice, go play on the "my cooper brake pedal fixes all braking system problems" thread .

 

 

Whats classic is the crap your talking..........

 

To do this you'd need to fit a blanking cap to the rad..............

 

ffs you can't put pressure behind a seal and expect it to pressurise the cooling system thats on the otherside of the seal.........

 

Remind me again what did you claim your job was in another post, something to do with fluids/hydraulics ?

 

 

No you don't - I'm really struggling to work out if you're just looking to make silly comments or if you actually don't understand. Never mind.

 

A standard cap has an air admittance valve to stop a vacuum developing when the system cools. I did mention it in my post, please try to keep up, especially if you want to try and and appear clever.

 

IMG_3660.jpg

 

image002.gif

 

I'm an engineer who specializes in heat transfer engineering - through software developing to commissioning high temp/ high pressure (600C/1500psi) turbine applicatons. I don'y however think it's necessary to worry about what I know, but rather what you clearly don't know :-)


Edited by Captain Mainwaring, 09 August 2013 - 05:53 AM.


#32 Yoda

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 06:12 AM

This is the valve that usually causes coolant issues when it does not seal properly, tis why i always suggest trying a different cap before taking things too far and pulling stuff off. either a known good one from a mates car or a new one as they are so cheap. and that phrase " so cheap" is why they fail regularly, the rubber seal is usually not real rubber and goes hard, affecting its sealing properties.

 

In fact. every mini owner should carry a spare!


Edited by Yoda, 15 August 2013 - 05:28 AM.


#33 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 06:48 AM

This is the valve that usually causes coolant issues when it does not seal properly, tis why i always suggest trying a different cap before taking things too far and pulling stuff off. either a know good one from a mates car or a new one as they are so cheap. and that phrase " so cheap" is why they fail regularly, the rubber seal is usually not real rubber and goes hard, affecting its sealing properties.

 

In fact. every mini owner should carry a spare!

 

 

Yep...if in any doubt just change it....

It's also the valve that lets you pressurize the cooling system through the rad overflow.... :-)



#34 DILLIGAF

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 11:42 AM

WFM, my apologies never noticed that before, of course tis is how those catch tanks work on the carbed rover coopers of the early nineties........



#35 Yoda

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 12:45 PM

suprise me you do Dilligaf. page 1 of the jedi manual this is on, LOL

 

but i do have a modified cap for pressurising purposes so that a leaky one of these does not affect my testing. but then i have already eliminated the cap leaking or not. I just like to do things in a particular logical ( to me ) order!



#36 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 01:03 AM

No need at all to apologize.

Nothing to do with catch tanks (expansion vessels) in the early 80's or any other decade for that matter. Pretty much every car will have a vacuum breaker to stop the hoses collapsing when the engine is cold - I'm really surprised you didn't know that.

 

I don't know about page 1 of the Jedi manual....it's on page 1 of the "things I should know before tinkering" manual.

 

Anyhow the OP can pressurize his cooling system via the expansion spigot on his radiator, should he so desire.


Edited by Captain Mainwaring, 10 August 2013 - 01:06 AM.


#37 DILLIGAF

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 09:47 AM

No need at all to apologize.

Nothing to do with catch tanks (expansion vessels) in the early 80's or any other decade for that matter. Pretty much every car will have a vacuum breaker to stop the hoses collapsing when the engine is cold - I'm really surprised you didn't know that.

 

I don't know about page 1 of the Jedi manual....it's on page 1 of the "things I should know before tinkering" manual.

 

Anyhow the OP can pressurize his cooling system via the expansion spigot on his radiator, should he so desire.

 

Well actually thats the only way the early nineties header tank and work, but of course you've probably not seen one...........



#38 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 10:09 AM

 

No need at all to apologize.

Nothing to do with catch tanks (expansion vessels) in the early 80's or any other decade for that matter. Pretty much every car will have a vacuum breaker to stop the hoses collapsing when the engine is cold - I'm really surprised you didn't know that.

 

I don't know about page 1 of the Jedi manual....it's on page 1 of the "things I should know before tinkering" manual.

 

Anyhow the OP can pressurize his cooling system via the expansion spigot on his radiator, should he so desire.

 

Well actually thats the only way the early nineties header tank and work, but of course you've probably not seen one...........

 

 

What are you talking about now? What am I supposed not to have seen?



#39 Yoda

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Posted 10 August 2013 - 10:29 AM

I have just had a brilliant idea!

 

 

 

Lets all shut up and stop bickering and see if the OP will come back to the thread for advice rather than arguments between other members eh!

 

We are here to try to help other people with little experience and knowledge, not to argue as to the best way to say "I know more than you know!" This is not directed to an individual, just a general comment on keeping threads short and concise. Ie, forget the science, unless needed to answer a query, just help them get the Mini working again.

 

I know i will be shot down on this one, but like a few others here, its getting annoying. 


Edited by Yoda, 10 August 2013 - 10:30 AM.


#40 daenesh

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 09:30 AM

finally someone speaks up.. all this bickering.. 3 pages of bickering..lol



#41 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 09:56 AM

finally someone speaks up.. all this bickering.. 3 pages of bickering..lol

 

 

Actually....I think you'll find that it started off as sensible comments with Ronald McDonald replies in the sidelines. Not sure if your looking to mengadu domba here but it's probably best left alone.



#42 Yoda

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 10:37 AM

Did you mean Cockfight! if so lets get this thread closed.

 

Mind you Daenesh did add "LOL" so maybe it was lighthearted and i wont have to Knight him with my lightsaber.



#43 Pog49

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 12:42 PM

Hey Guys, thanks for all your help and suggestions! As the engine isn't boiling I am going to keep an eye on it for now.

On a separate note,

I'm looking for somewhere to get my carb set up properly in the Hertfordshire area, does anyone know of/have experience with anywhere that could help me out?

Also, when I rev the engine after starting, the exhaust kicks out alot of black spots, does anyone know the cause or solution? Is this something I need to worry about?



#44 Yoda

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 12:48 PM

No worries, you may find the sooty spots will stop once you have had the carb tuned correctly, its most likely running a bit rich, which can cause the sootyness. 

 

I would help but i am down in kent and i dont suppose you fancy paying time and mileage just to get to you LOL.



#45 Yoda

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Posted 14 August 2013 - 12:52 PM

Would you believe it I just came back to work from a two week break only to have two machines overheating. Turned out both had weak springs on the vacuum valves. Two new rad caps later and both were back out working.







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