1843 replies to this topic

[Artstu]

  Looked like the previous owners really neglected it: front end panels, scuttle panel, boot and sills were completely rusted through, and the engine bay didn't fair much better... Hopefully not long left now though...

 

 

Just used as an everyday car I'd have thought. No neglect, but no special pampering these rust buckets need, had it been almost any other car on the road I bet it wouldn't have had any rust at all. That's Rover Mini's for you.

[vsl_london]

 

  Looked like the previous owners really neglected it: front end panels, scuttle panel, boot and sills were completely rusted through, and the engine bay didn't fair much better... Hopefully not long left now though...

 

 

Just used as an everyday car I'd have thought. No neglect, but no special pampering these rust buckets need, had it been almost any other car on the road I bet it wouldn't have had any rust at all. That's Rover Mini's for you.

 

 

Quite right. Wonder if the rumours I heard about the surplus mini panels are true, where they were left outside in the open for a while, and then be fitted onto new cars without any treatment at all...

 

At the end of the day I suppose it just makes you appreciate the well kept examples even more, especially the daily drivers.

[Petrol]

The bottom line is corrosion like this on a 1998 car

 

 

 

 

Is down to poor build quality and not owner neglect

 

New Heritage shells are no better either, spot welds and primed is not the way to go and that’s pretty well documented in this thread. That’s why I have gone the extra mile to go down the blasting / zinc coating in all of the seams. Got loads more done today but nothing worthy of posting any pics.
Pete
 

 

[vsl_london]

Hi Pete,

 

  Bit of a stupid question I know, but I was wondering, what's the reason behind zinc coating the seams? Is it primarily to stop any existing rust from spreading, or does it work well to prevent any future build up too? And if so, does it make sense to galvanize entire panels more prone to rust, like A and front panels?

 

Victor

[Artstu]

Hi Pete,

 

  Bit of a stupid question I know, but I was wondering, what's the reason behind zinc coating the seams? Is it primarily to stop any existing rust from spreading, or does it work well to prevent any future build up too? And if so, does it make sense to galvanize entire panels more prone to rust, like A and front panels?

 

Victor

 

If you had read any of this thread you would not be asking that question 

[vsl_london]

 

Hi Pete,

 

  Bit of a stupid question I know, but I was wondering, what's the reason behind zinc coating the seams? Is it primarily to stop any existing rust from spreading, or does it work well to prevent any future build up too? And if so, does it make sense to galvanize entire panels more prone to rust, like A and front panels?

 

Victor

 

If you had read any of this thread you would not be asking that question 

 

 

Sorry, I'm being a complete idiot here. Only got as far as page 6 last night before posting that question

 

Just going through the rest now and see what a stupid question that was... 

[Petrol]

Only got as far as page 6 last night before posting that question

 

 

Don’t worry, most people just flick through the pics on forums

It’s not possible to galvanise panels. The process involves dipping the part into molten zinc that would buckle it. I took some pics of what I did with the C pillar.

Split with a small screwdriver, if you can see through it’s better because the blast media can pass right through.
 

 

Shotblasted, where possible I do both sides.

 

 

Then I force thinned Zinc in. I’m using Bilt Hamber Electrox and it’s thinned with Xylene about 50 50. I spray at about 60 PSI (4 bar) to ensure the paint is forced right up to the spot welds. It’s messy and gets everywhere so I wipe off the surplus with a kitchen towel.

 

 

I then brush un-thinned paint into the seam on both sides. Takes a bit of working to remove any air voids

 

 

 

Whilst still wet, the seam was closed using mole grips, again it oozes out everywhere. This results in the seam having 100% coverage of zinc. No air means no rust ever. If there was any slight corrosion that wasn’t shotblased out, the zinc will sacrifice itself to kill it. Also if there are any slight voids or air gaps, the zinc will consume the oxygen again preventing further corrosion.

 

 

I’m going to fill a lot of imperfections with paint rather than filler. The main drawback with body filler is it often shrinks under the paint causing mapping out. This leaves a profile of the filler in the paint finish. Contrary to popular belief, 2K paint is an air drying product and when sprayed or even brushed on thick, can take months to fully harden. By flatting it back, it breaks the shiny skin and allows the solvents to evaporate. I’ve flatted the floor back ready to fill any grinding marks with paint.

 

 

 

More on that later

 

Pete

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rally515]

Well i guess i'm more than convinced about splitting my seams on the mk2 project, but i,ve got enough on my plate at the minute with mine so as you say Pete "more on that later"!!

 

Seriously alot more thought than usual going into this, i wonder if this is the way we'll all learn to do a mini resto in coming years ? i think so, makes sensse doesn't it.

 

Cliff

[vsl_london]

Wow, never realized just how much effort goes into reparing seams if doing it properly. Thanks very much for the detailed explanation!

 

I had a look over at some of the other projects people have encountered, and I see a lot of very patchy jobs where the seams are the first to go on a mini after a few years. Such as this bad boy.

 

Out of curiousity (I hope this hasn't been asked on here before), how much Bilt and Xylene does it take to carry out a single C pillar repair such as the one above, as it seems like a very messy process?

[Jase]

Hi Pete, a fantastic job, extremely thorough and hopefully completely rust proof. I have to disagree with this statement though:

 

"New Heritage shells are no better either, spot welds and primed is not the way to go and that’s pretty well documented in this thread. That’s why I have gone the extra mile to go down the blasting / zinc coating in all of the seams."

 

The new shells have far more protection on them than all of the shells produced right from 59 and as we know the later cars had major issues with quality of metal etc. It's true the seams are not protected internally but I think they will start last for many many years if looked after without any major issues.

 

The only issues I have ever had with Mini's are A panels, rear subby, bottoms of doors and the bottom corners of the windscreen. Never owned a later car so can't comment about them. Never had issues with seams.

 

Keep up the good work, always looking forward to the next installment.

 

Best wishes

 

Jason

[Petrol]

Hi Victor,

Don’t worry about asking questions, after all that’s what forums are all about. The Electrox primer I am using comes in 1L tins. That should be enough to do every seam on a Mini. 1L of xylene which you can get on ebay, is enough to thin it. To clean the gun, I use standard car paint thinners as it’s cheaper than xylene but it’s not a good idea to use it to thin the zinc paint. This is down to the binders in the Electrox and would significantly reduce its performance.

Hi Jason and thanks for the kind words.
Modern shells are bright steel panels mainly spot welded then acid dipped to remove the rust caused by the welding process. This is followed by a rinse to remove the acid and an E-coat which is the best protection available at the moment for mass produced mild steel shells. Heritage shells are welded up like all other shells – bright steel but then sprayed in primer. Since most primers are porous it then depends on the relative humidity that the shell is stored. If it’s damp, it will rust. Since there is no protection in the seams at all, they are not exactly going the extra mile to prevent corrosion. Replacement panels that Heritage offer are however E coated but I have seen rust behind the E-coat on even the simplest of panels.  It doesn’t inspire confidence.

At the end of the day, how long a Mini will last depends on the environment that it’s stored in and how good the protection is.
 

I popped over to see a friend who is helping me out a lot, I can’t thank him enough so Phil, if you read this…..

 

 

He told me it would be a good idea to replace 2nd gear in the gearbox but they seem hard to find these days. Minispares had them in stock so I had to check I bought the right part. Off came the box

 

 

This is the problem, these synchro teeth can wear

 

 

 

New 2nd gear

 

 

Decided to get an X Pin diff as well

 

 

 

 

Back to the shell, finished the boot floor and all seam sealed. Also welded in the spare wheel retainer

 

 

Pete

 

 

 

 

 

[Jase]

Hi Pete, they are now dipped and the turnaround is very quick as they only run a small number. I know when I bought my clubman shell they only manufactured five and these were to order, so pressed, assembled and dipped and then shipped to the customer.

 

The coating is extremely thick but as you say the seams are manufactured the same way and you have to prepare and take care of the car if you don't want a rust problem.

 

Jason

[Noah]

Good choice with the X-Pin. You aren't going to be blowing that up anytime soon.

[Petrol]

Hi Pete, they are now dipped and the turnaround is very quick as they only run a small number. I

 

Didn't know that they now dip them, sorry for any misleading info I have posted

 

 

Good choice with the X-Pin. You aren't going to be blowing that up anytime soon.

 

Hopefully it's 1 less thing to worry about.

 

Been fortunate with the weather so far but want to try to cover as much primer as I possibly can for winter.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Removing the black paint from Magnum panels can be a right pain especially when it’s on thick like this edge

 

 

I’ve found it comes off easier by dipping a toothbrush in thinners and scrubbing it.

 

Pete

[Petrol]

So far, every area of the shell that has been repaired has had the seams split and rust sorted … bar this. It’s where the flitch panel meets the A post



These are the spot welds from the other side



Couldn’t see any rust inside the seam but decided to pour some Electrox in just in case. Just to add, when the shell is finally sprayed it will be going onto a spit for a good dose of box section wax (not waxoyl!) But couldn’t see how to get the wax inside this seam once the shell is finished. I came up with this to get the zinc in.



Plugged the bottom with some sealer



The zinc primer looks like it had penetrated the seam, this is how it looked after I had wiped the surplus off



Next job is the dash top rail and fabricating some proper brackets for the dashboard. After a quick trial fit this evening, looks like it needs a bit of work.

Thanks for looking
Pete
 

Edited by Petrol, 06 October 2013 - 10:27 PM.