Cheers for the answers people keep them coming
To Vtec Or Not
Started by
wainesworld
, Mar 29 2012 08:41 AM
25 replies to this topic
#16
wainesworld
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One Carb Or Two?
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 07:07 AM
#17
newnham500
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:13 AM
In my humble little opinion, at the end of the day an a series is still an a series. no matter how much you spend on it, its still only got one cam, not overhead. it can only go to 1380, cast block and head. and to get it to some sort of serious power you have to over come problems that are enginered out of modern engines as standard. and then, if you blow it up, you waste alot of money.
So it really comes down to what you want the mini to do, if you want to drive around enjoying the experiance of MINI. then leave the engine and have fun, if on the other hand you want a mini that will tear anyone that tries it on a new one. with out the fear of it breaking down or blowing up each time you use it then it only seems locical to use a modern engine. hell, thats why engines move on, to design problems out. I see the arguement to keeping an a series, but no matter how much you try, a modern standard vtec will perform better for longer for less money. yes you can make an a series have more power than a vtec,
1. at what sort of cost.
2. more power than a standard vtec, no matter which way you cut it. if you did the same mods to a vtec that you did to an a series. there's no compairing.
I would say though, on the new engine thing, the front wasnt designed for engines like this, so mid mount it and save the under steer.
So it really comes down to what you want the mini to do, if you want to drive around enjoying the experiance of MINI. then leave the engine and have fun, if on the other hand you want a mini that will tear anyone that tries it on a new one. with out the fear of it breaking down or blowing up each time you use it then it only seems locical to use a modern engine. hell, thats why engines move on, to design problems out. I see the arguement to keeping an a series, but no matter how much you try, a modern standard vtec will perform better for longer for less money. yes you can make an a series have more power than a vtec,
1. at what sort of cost.
2. more power than a standard vtec, no matter which way you cut it. if you did the same mods to a vtec that you did to an a series. there's no compairing.
I would say though, on the new engine thing, the front wasnt designed for engines like this, so mid mount it and save the under steer.
#18
jaydee
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:21 AM
I tend to disagree, a forced induction A-series with 150 bph will have more torque than a v-tec, and wont screw up weight distribution..
#19
newnham500
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:22 AM
and a mid mounted forced induction vtec?
#20
jaydee
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:31 AM
Oh, sorry, it was my fault because i wasnt explaing very well..
I meant that an a-series is capable of more than a v-tec and the mini will be keeping the same handling caratheristic, but yes, you can spend whatever you want on a-series engines, the vtec will outperform it spending the same cash..
But considering the cost of the conversion, you can build a turbo mini with roughly the power of a vtec and more torque.
I meant that an a-series is capable of more than a v-tec and the mini will be keeping the same handling caratheristic, but yes, you can spend whatever you want on a-series engines, the vtec will outperform it spending the same cash..
But considering the cost of the conversion, you can build a turbo mini with roughly the power of a vtec and more torque.
#21
newnham500
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:38 AM
yea its all swings and roundabouts. see you can keep the handling if you mount the vtec in the middle, i now what im doing in two years when my 1275 dies.
#22
jameswildcooper
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:51 AM
but you have to think how much does it cost for upgraded bits for the honda engine compared to the A series....ALOT more!
cam for A series hundred or so quid? twin cams on the honda...decent good pair your looking at £400+ really
cam for A series hundred or so quid? twin cams on the honda...decent good pair your looking at £400+ really
#23
Tahiti Joe
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:56 AM
yea its all swings and roundabouts. see you can keep the handling if you mount the vtec in the middle, i now what im doing in two years when my 1275 dies.
A mid engined daily V-TEC? Bugger that!
Turbocharged A-series? Much easier too live with in my eyes... And cheaper too produce one with decent road burning figures...! Saying that, a N/A 1380 well built using something like an SW10 will see you over a 100 bananas.... A 100 bananas is a lot of power in a Mini!
Besides, the VTECs arent always all there cracked up too be, ive worked on loads, everything from Del Sols to S2000s, the noise soon got on me nerves, nothing like an A-series rumble... Plus Honda gearboxes are generally made from cheese....!
#24
newnham500
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 10:07 AM
we could always scrap the vtec idea and go with a merlin, 
#25
Bungle
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Posted 30 March 2012 - 10:53 AM
In my humble little opinion, at the end of the day an a series is still an a series. no matter how much you spend on it, its still only got one cam, not overhead. it can only go to 1380, cast block and head. and to get it to some sort of serious power you have to over come problems that are enginered out of modern engines as standard. and then, if you blow it up, you waste alot of money.
have you not seen the alloy double over head cam conversions ?
Visard took a mini engine out to almost 1600
#26
MIGLIACARS
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Posted 24 September 2012 - 12:01 PM
hello.
well i can speak from a world of expensive experience here.
but before that NEWNHAM500 A series can be taken to 1600cc.
i had a full race mini, a real racer not just a quick mini. it was 1380cc the proper thing dogbox webber full race head. and it was very quick indeed, it embarrassed a lot of fast race cars. it was quite reliable but with any full race A series it had its problems, but in the search for more power i had a seven port head put on it £3500 for the head (going back some years now) plus carbs £700 plus linkage so on so on.in the end with a full rebuild it came to around £10000. anyway it was rolling roaded and took it to race at cadwell park one weekend, but i took it on the friday as there was a testday. everything was perfect as i sat ticking over in the holding area, the gates opened and out went the bda escort mk1 followed by my dad in his race mini (first time out for him) we all went round hall bends ,hairpin ,barn corner and on the start finish at which point my old man and the mk1 escort went flying off into the distance, i glanced at the oil pressure / water temp and carried on briskly but not revving it hard, got to the gooseneck in 4th not going fast glanced at the gauges again all perfect, cogged it down to third and floored it on going about 4000rpm and BANG out came a rod taking with it the head crank block diff box everything had gone.
this made me think, i need more power more reliably less cost, perfect a vtec conversion 1b2 16 paid a well known company £8500 for it, it looked a real weapon, but it was 10 seconds a lap slower it killed the mini i persivered for a season but it no avail.
i blue two up not a lot to replace but not the bulletproof engine there meant to be.
and the gearing is awful 1St was a no no,off the line to much wheel spin so it was never used and it never called for 5th on a British circuit, so in effect it was a 3 speed mini, not good at all,
as for the handling it had no feel . awful , i let several people drive it and they all had similar views to me.
up to 60mph i know the A series was faster. to 100mph about the same but after that the vtec was much quicker.
i sold the mini to a bloke in france £6500 i was glad to see it go but wished id never ever done that HORRIBLE conversion.
luckily i had a very quick metro at the time its on you tube, 1380cc very quick. but again i wanted more power so i went seven port again dta fuel injected rotrex super charger put together at great expense buy a man who can. this is the important part
total cost £20000 engine and box
.the car worked out the box.
a perfect engine
also on youtube much better than any vtec i can promise you that.
advise dont do it
keep the A series
spend the money get it done correctly
look after it properly
well i can speak from a world of expensive experience here.
but before that NEWNHAM500 A series can be taken to 1600cc.
i had a full race mini, a real racer not just a quick mini. it was 1380cc the proper thing dogbox webber full race head. and it was very quick indeed, it embarrassed a lot of fast race cars. it was quite reliable but with any full race A series it had its problems, but in the search for more power i had a seven port head put on it £3500 for the head (going back some years now) plus carbs £700 plus linkage so on so on.in the end with a full rebuild it came to around £10000. anyway it was rolling roaded and took it to race at cadwell park one weekend, but i took it on the friday as there was a testday. everything was perfect as i sat ticking over in the holding area, the gates opened and out went the bda escort mk1 followed by my dad in his race mini (first time out for him) we all went round hall bends ,hairpin ,barn corner and on the start finish at which point my old man and the mk1 escort went flying off into the distance, i glanced at the oil pressure / water temp and carried on briskly but not revving it hard, got to the gooseneck in 4th not going fast glanced at the gauges again all perfect, cogged it down to third and floored it on going about 4000rpm and BANG out came a rod taking with it the head crank block diff box everything had gone.
this made me think, i need more power more reliably less cost, perfect a vtec conversion 1b2 16 paid a well known company £8500 for it, it looked a real weapon, but it was 10 seconds a lap slower it killed the mini i persivered for a season but it no avail.
i blue two up not a lot to replace but not the bulletproof engine there meant to be.
and the gearing is awful 1St was a no no,off the line to much wheel spin so it was never used and it never called for 5th on a British circuit, so in effect it was a 3 speed mini, not good at all,
as for the handling it had no feel . awful , i let several people drive it and they all had similar views to me.
up to 60mph i know the A series was faster. to 100mph about the same but after that the vtec was much quicker.
i sold the mini to a bloke in france £6500 i was glad to see it go but wished id never ever done that HORRIBLE conversion.
luckily i had a very quick metro at the time its on you tube, 1380cc very quick. but again i wanted more power so i went seven port again dta fuel injected rotrex super charger put together at great expense buy a man who can. this is the important part
total cost £20000 engine and box
.the car worked out the box.
a perfect engine
also on youtube much better than any vtec i can promise you that.
advise dont do it
keep the A series
spend the money get it done correctly
look after it properly
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