18 replies to this topic

[charm_muppet]

Mini Clubman Estate
1980

I purchased a second hand disc setup from a forum member. He said everything was good to bolt straight on to convert my drums to discs.

So far I have discovered and rectified the following...

The ball bearing 'knuckle' on the discs driveshafts are bigger than the drum counterpart - swapped over
Discs and pads were shot (would have replaced anyway) - replaced
Rubber brake hoses replaced with braided ones.

Having fitted the setup for the third time...grrr...I noticed that there was movement when i pushed the top and bottom of the wheels (car was on stands) I assumed it was worn wheel bearings so ordered a set for each side.

Just spent 4 hours in -3 degrees (wish I had a garage) pulling the front hubs off, removing old bearings (didnt seem too bad) and fitting new ones, well packed with grease etc.

Fitted OS first, torqued hub nut and all semed fine, did the NS, finished everyhtnig up, tested and there is still movement! Went back to check OS and there seems to be slight movement there too...my fingers and toes were hurting by this stage (

Any suggestions?

Outer CV need replacing maybe? Although during assesmbly everthing seemed to fit well.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

matt

Edited by charm_muppet, 03 December 2010 - 05:50 PM.

[1984mini25]

If you still have play and the hub nuts have been touqred properly and the CV joint is seating in the bearing and flanges ok, then it could only really be the ball joints left.

[charm_muppet]

I thought that might be the case but I have already checked them, I stripped them down and there was no wear.

The movement seems to be vertical not horizontal (if you know what I mean)

Is it likely the CV joints could have worn?

Thanks for the advice so far.

Matt

[1984mini25]

I thought that might be the case but I have already checked them, I stripped them down and there was no wear.

The movement seems to be vertical not horizontal (if you know what I mean)

Is it likely the CV joints could have worn?

Thanks for the advice so far.

Matt

It’s passable.

You could try loosening off the hub nuts again, removing the cone split washer, fitting a large washer and tightening the nut back up. In the hope it pulls the CV joint all the way through and seats in the bearings properly. Then swapping the washer back over for the cone one and retorquing

Lowering the car to the ground with a standard steel wheel bolted to the hub will also make losening/tightening/torquing the hub nuts back up easier.

[charm_muppet]

Does the cone washer not allow the CV joint to be pulled through completely? Cant fit a steel wheel as I dont have one and the wheels i took off are 10" so wont fit over discs...doh!

Matt

[ibrooks]

The washer being cone shaped can get a grip on the CV joint's shaft and you get the torque figure but the bearings aren't seated. Haynes details the flat washer you should use first to seat everything.

You can also get a problem with the drive-flanges whereby if they haven't been torqued up properly and the bearings have been spinning against the drive flange they machine a very neat groove in the back of the flange. It really looks like it should be there - it shouldn't and mucks up the clearances.

Iain

[Dan]

If the play is only in one direction, the problem is not the wheelbearings. Play top to bottom means ball joints.

If you didn't seat the wheel bearing with a flat washer, the bearing might be a little slack though and if it's pinched a groove into the CV this will need polishing out before the bearing will ever nip up properly. If its been driven in this condition the bearing should be replaced, if any groove it has worn in the CV is very pronounced this should be replaced too.

[charm_muppet]

When you say top to bottom, you mean up and down?

When i push and pull the top of the wheel it moves in and out (camber)

I didnt seat the bearing with a washer. Havent driven it yet.

Matt

[Dan]

I mean top to bottom like you said in your first post! Yes up and down. The wheel bearing would allow play in all directions across its axis if it was slack. Also, play in a wheel bearing will disappear with the brakes applied.

[charm_muppet]

Thank you for your advice. Although I said "movement when i pushed the top and bottom of the wheels" not up&down.

I think it must be the bearings not seating...I will strip the hubs down, again and check for marks on the cv's if all is OK i'll re-assemble and tighten with a large washer to pull them together.

Thanks

Matt

[Southy]

As others had said movement on the wheel at 12 and 6 o'clock means wear in the ball joints.Replace for new ones

[Dan]

Although I said "movement when i pushed the top and bottom of the wheels"

, I know! That's why I also said top to bottom! I would normally say up and down or 12 and 6 but I tried to use the same terms as you had to avoid confusion, seems not to have worked!

Never mind, anyhow the problem really doesn't sound like the wheel bearing. I know you think you have done the ball joints but they are fiddly things and need an experienced feel to set them properly. If you can only feel play in one direction across the wheel, and applying the brakes takes up the play, then I promise you the problem is not the wheel bearings.

[crazycoleman118]

i had this problem on one side of mine, turned out the thread was stripped on the end of the outer cv joint, put a new one on and it still wasnt perfect, rocked the wheel again and it turned out the ball joints wernt seated in there cups properly and was causing it to work its way loose!! ( a minor modification and a new ball joint all shimmed up and it was fine)

[MRA]

It could be CV joint......... run your finger along the shaft bit to see if there is a step.... if there is replace.

to tell if its your ball joints simply have an accomplice apply the foot brakes if play then ball joints if no play, wheel bearings, cv or drive flange..... or in extreme cases hub.

lap in your swivel pins to get longg life and smoothness

[charm_muppet]

A quick update...

Having replaced the wheel bearings, I have now replaced (and lapped) 4 new ball joints. I correctly torqued the hub nuts using a large washer, allowed time for bearings to settle. Fitted cone washer, retorqued...and still movement!

I have now recieved a new pair of outer CV joints.

I had a thought that I'd like to run past the more experienced mini folk...whats the liklihood that the spacer that came with the new bearings is slightly wider tha the original, hence not allowing the bearings to seat fully? I don't know if this could be an issue but was going to fit the old one anyway.

Have a good christmas everyone

Matt