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Mini/mini United Not Divided


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#121 The_Mistro

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 10:31 PM

but thats not the argument, tell me, apart from the name, what the MINI and Mini share, which other "small" cars dont already share with the Mini!

I have to say this is exactly how i feel, the name is the only resemblance


the name is the only thing! made in britian is not even an argument as so are nissan micras and honda civics, there jap cars though! the same way a MINI is a german car! and to top it of, there french engines!

Yes French engines built at hams hall Birmingham. They are a joint venture just like the Honda/rover days. Most car companies now share with each other as it's cheaper is the fiat 500 uses the same foot pan as the vauxhall corsa and the ford ka. The engines are a joint venture between BMW/Peugot/citreon, with minis built in Birmingham and the French built in france.


i know how car companies work! yep and none of them companies are british! and it just shows that the MINI is just like every other "small" (i suppose a more fitting way of putting it is EUROBOX) car on the road! so you have just proved the point i was making!

Edited by The_Mistro, 08 September 2010 - 10:36 PM.


#122 mab01uk

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 10:49 PM

but thats not the argument, tell me, apart from the name, what the MINI and Mini share, which other "small" cars dont already share with the Mini!


What would ANY new design of Mini have shared with the original 41 year old design? What did Issigonis replacement the 9X share? What does any new model of car share with the previous model these days.......not much if anything? More and more over the years progress, laws and competition in the market place has mean't most new cars share little in the way of components with previous models to stay ahead. Gone are the days of a quick rebody of a Morris Minor to get a 'new' Morris Marina...............people don't have to or want to buy some old made-over old design anymore.

The New MINI design was approached by Frank Stephenson imagining it had been redesigned every 10 years since 1970 like most other small cars and evolved and grown in size like all the competition have, even the new Fiat 500 has grown by exactly the same proportions over the tiny original.

Despite what is said the 3 door hatch MINI is almost the smallest modern 'Supermini' in length on the market, smaller than say the Yaris/Fiesta /Corsa/Clio, etc. Why was it not an even smaller cheaper Mini class car..........because to be profitable it would have needed to be built in a cheap East European or Far Eastern factory like the Ford KA /Fiat 500/ Panda/ Citroen C1/Peugeot 107 etc, which would have meant closing down the MINI factory at Cowley Oxford. The solution risky at the time, was to build and sell a more expensive upmarket prestige supermini which could be built profitabily in the high wage western economy of the UK. It was a risk no one had tried it before and BMW were aiming to sell 100,000 MINI's a year. A unique unshared platform with expensive complex but sporting rear suspension and solid build quality was the result with loads of customer options. Within 10 years they were making 300,000 a year and adding new models to the range at both top and bottom as well as re-entering an expensive branch of motorsport. Now it is thought you will get your small city car as MINI makes enough money to expand and possibly build it somewhere cheaper than the UK, which is planned to get expanded production of the new Coupe and Roadster/Speedster models next year.

And now other car manufacturers want a slice of the action and are designing upmarket small 'drivers' cars to compete with the MINI as people are downsizing from larger cars but want a well built prestige small car as a replacement.

Edited by mab01uk, 09 September 2010 - 06:01 AM.


#123 The_Mistro

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 10:53 PM

right so sporty suspension and a good build quality is unique?

edit: yet they managed to mess up the powersteering on early models!

Edited by The_Mistro, 08 September 2010 - 10:54 PM.


#124 the-green-monkey

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 10:54 PM

I think even if it were really British the BINI still wouldnt have the same appeal to me, i mean i dont even like SPI or MPIs, for me the BINI is missing all the things i love about the mini, an A series engine, a BIG REVOLUTIONARY idea, and a generally hand built feel. Thats just the way i am, i like the idea of something new, not something thats just got the badge of something that was once popular on it. But to be honest this topic to me has no point because you cant change the way BINI lovers feel just like you cant change the way i feel so >_<

#125 sazal

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 10:57 PM

You have a good attitude towards it, but a ive had run in's with a few people that dont:

The lastest example was at Crich Mini show this year, a lady in a new Mini (she was 1 of 2 there) parked on our clubstand while we were on a parade. When we came back and she was politely asked to move her car as it was parked in a stand that had been organised (we had also already had our clubstand moved once!), she suddenly jumped to the conclusion that it was because we all hated the new Mini, so therefore didnt want the car included in our stand. We didnt have anywhere else to park as it was already a squeeze as it was. As she got in her Bini, she turned to her passenger who was stood outside the car and said loudly for us all to hear "Just think what I paid for my car I could have 5 of those" pointing at our classics. Its people like this who ruin it for the New Mini owners who want both new and old mini to be united. Ive heard similar stories and also had a Bini owner repeatedly leaning on my car at Stanford Hall last year after me asking him not to.

I think theres 2 types of people that own a new Mini. The ones like yourself who like the classic Mini and have bought one because it is the new mini and a good, modern, reliable, but still fun to drive car. And the others who have bought them just for the fact that its just one of the new cars on the market, but couldnt give 2 hoots about the classic and think they are superior to classic Mini owners as they have a nice new car. But its these people that ruin it.

#126 the-green-monkey

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:03 PM

but thats not the argument, tell me, apart from the name, what the MINI and Mini share, which other "small" cars dont already share with the Mini!

What does any new model of car share with the previous model these days.......not much if anything? More and more over the years progress, laws and competition in the market place has mean't most new cars share little in the way of components with previous models to stay ahead. Gone are the days of a quick rebody of a Morris Minor to get a 'new' Morris Marina...............people don't have to or want to buy some old made-over old design anymore.

2 words, porsche 911, has barely changed since, forever. Not only that the cayman and the boxter are pretty much the same, the cayman only exists to fill a gap between the boxter and the 911.

#127 JimCooper

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:03 PM

I have a 2008 MINI Cooper S which I bought new because I needed something reliable, modern, fun to drive, economical and with good performance. When looking at <20k new cars there really isn't much that can match the Cooper S especially when you take emissions into consideration which is important if like me you buy it through your company.

My passion has always been for the classic Mini though and I have had 2 prior to buying my Cooper S and 2 since, there are many others in the same situation as me. I was happy that I could park my MINI in a designated area at this year's Gaydon show but as soon as I parked off I went to eye up the classic Minis!
From being on the MINI2 forums briefly it appears that many MINI owners buy them because they used to own an original Mini but want something more modern/safer. Also with a new car you have warranty and no stress about rust etc which is important if you have a demanding job or no mechanical knowledge.

For all the people who are saying that the MINI bears no resemblence to a classic Mini well compare the Mk1 Golf or Mk1 Fiesta to the 2010 models there's even less of a resemblence there. The New Beetle, 500 etc are all larger and like the MINI are just caracatures of their legendary predecessors but really, what else could they be? Innovative car design peaked decades ago and due to carbon footprints, modern safety laws, efficient manufacturing processes and customer demand, cars are becoming bigger, more refined and duller year upon year.
I would LOVE to have been able to walk into a Rover dealership 2 years ago and drive a Cooper Sport out but sadly that was never an option and never will be, I just had to go for the next best thing, which I wasn't 100% sold on until I test drove one - it is very different to drive than the same age Corsa, fiesta, focus & golf which I also test drove at the same time - I wonder how many people dismissing the MINI have driven one?

Enthusiasts should appreciate a car for how it drives, feels and looks rather than it's image or how some of its drivers behave.

#128 mab01uk

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:04 PM

right so sporty suspension and a good build quality is unique?

edit: yet they managed to mess up the powersteering on early models!


It was unique in the small car market in 2001, most small cars had and still have a cheap beam rear axle and lower quality plastics used for interior trim, etc.

The electro-hydraulic power steering was UK sourced and designed by Rover as they insisted on a very direct but not over assisted system to give the Go Kart feel that is so popular with Mini drivers. That is now possible with more reliable all electric systems as technology has moved on.
Read post no.5 here for more detail on the MINI power steering design, etc by a Rover Engineer:
http://www.theminifo...showtopic=51737

Edited by mab01uk, 08 September 2010 - 11:09 PM.


#129 danie garry

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:08 PM

in my opinion i think that if the MINI wasnt made then classic minis wouldnt be so popular now, the MINI sorta revived the mini.
i dont like the look of the MINI, its too soft and not very mini! but its more of a car for today, needs an oil change every 6k and requires very little maintanace. i dont think that the majority of people would like to have to much more than wash the car each wk end, i know i'm doing more than just washing my mini each week.
MINI is more like a microwave meal, quick and easy to get and requires very little to prepare and get going whereas the mini is a full 5 course meal that takes an age to get perfect and u dont want to rush into it!!

#130 JimCooper

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:15 PM

You have a good attitude towards it, but a ive had run in's with a few people that dont:

The lastest example was at Crich Mini show this year, a lady in a new Mini (she was 1 of 2 there) parked on our clubstand while we were on a parade. When we came back and she was politely asked to move her car as it was parked in a stand that had been organised (we had also already had our clubstand moved once!), she suddenly jumped to the conclusion that it was because we all hated the new Mini, so therefore didnt want the car included in our stand. We didnt have anywhere else to park as it was already a squeeze as it was. As she got in her Bini, she turned to her passenger who was stood outside the car and said loudly for us all to hear "Just think what I paid for my car I could have 5 of those" pointing at our classics. Its people like this who ruin it for the New Mini owners who want both new and old mini to be united. Ive heard similar stories and also had a Bini owner repeatedly leaning on my car at Stanford Hall last year after me asking him not to.

I think theres 2 types of people that own a new Mini. The ones like yourself who like the classic Mini and have bought one because it is the new mini and a good, modern, reliable, but still fun to drive car. And the others who have bought them just for the fact that its just one of the new cars on the market, but couldnt give 2 hoots about the classic and think they are superior to classic Mini owners as they have a nice new car. But its these people that ruin it.



To be honest, I would be annoyed if I was told to move my car regardless of what type it was, that comment was probably just said in anger to wind whever evicted them from their spot.

I have been in Mini clubs where people have slagged each other's classics off at shows as they were put out theirs wasnt on the front row of the club stand.

I also doubt that the person leaning on your car was doing it because it was a classic - they were probably just a bit dim and would have leaned against it if it was a MINI. I have had to tell various people off for leaning against my cars.

Leaving a mini show in 2000 my girlfriend's Mini Racing green decided to destroy it's engine and we waited on the side of the road out of the show grounds for 2 hours waiting for recovery. Not one other Mini driver stopped to see if we needed help and lots were laughing as they went past.

It's all swings and roundabouts, some people are just cocks regardless of what cars they drive.

#131 mini93

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:15 PM

[ What does any new model of car share with the previous model these days.......not much if anything? More and more over the years progress, laws and competition in the market place has mean't most new cars share little in the way of components with previous models to stay ahead.



sorry but thats just not right, theres plenty of cars which share common parts, not just between different marks but more commonly now through out the range and even changability from different companys, lowering the development cost is the aim of the game and keeping certain equipment standard lowers the unit cost even more so when other models/companys use them.

Also upto the Mitsubish X the vehicles were largly the same, everything was interchangable which is why alot of the people who use the mitsibish rally car dislike the X because of the lack of interchangability...you can hardly say its not full of technology either as it probably has more than your standard car...it comes at a premium due to being a market leader but if it was dont in quantity of say a fiesta costs go down, its simple economy.
thers probably alot of other examples but its the 1st one that sticks out in my mind >_<

#132 JimCooper

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:17 PM

in my opinion i think that if the MINI wasnt made then classic minis wouldnt be so popular now, the MINI sorta revived the mini.
i dont like the look of the MINI, its too soft and not very mini! but its more of a car for today, needs an oil change every 6k and requires very little maintanace. i dont think that the majority of people would like to have to much more than wash the car each wk end, i know i'm doing more than just washing my mini each week.
MINI is more like a microwave meal, quick and easy to get and requires very little to prepare and get going whereas the mini is a full 5 course meal that takes an age to get perfect and u dont want to rush into it!!


Spot on!

Mine went over 20K before it had it's oil changed.

#133 Redbaron6969uk

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:18 PM

My personal opinion is that it has nowt to do with how nice the new MINI is.....I love the looks of the new MINI (which were designed mainly at Longbridge many year before BMW took over)

I think the countryman looks rubbish though.

The loathing I have for BMW and hence the MINI is the way in which BMW asset stripped Rover to a point where it was unsalvagable.

And yes I appreciate that the rot started with Thatcher.

And yes the militantancy and workers of the 70's didnt help ( of which most of my family were )

But Britain has never been more militant than France yet France still has a thriving car industry.

SO as I say BMW vertually stole Rover with assistance from the British government and asset stripped it until it was value less.

I was supposed to order my new 60 BMW 320 last month I think they are beautiful cars but have refused and am now awaiting an Insignia, god damn priniples lol

As for Jaguar Landrover etc...... they have been bought and saved in a completely different way so the feeling toward them is different IMO.

IT MAY BE A MINI BUT IT IS ALSO A BMW.....nuf sed

#134 the-green-monkey

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:21 PM

Posted Image
Posted Image
Are they the same car? both say escort...

EDIT: changed the picture of the newer escort because it was huge lol

Edited by the-green-monkey, 08 September 2010 - 11:23 PM.


#135 danie garry

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 11:23 PM

yea but the bottom pic's huge!!
obviously the mk 1 escort is a classic as is the mk1 mini over the mk5. things just change i guess




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