12 replies to this topic

[Island blue]

MK1 Mini
1966
A+ 1000 cc engine, Cooper S brakes
Intermittent rotational sound from front end.

I have an intermittent rotational sound from the front end, sounds like something is grinding / catching Seems to be worse at low speeds although it may be because I can't hear it at higher road speeds due to engine and wind noise. Makes no difference if I am braking gently or accelerating or if the car is out of gear while rolling (If I brake hard the car stops too quickly to tell as it is low speed 15 mph or less.)

The car is fitted with 7.5 inch discs and has had new inner and outer CV's the front wheel bearings have also been replaced.

The bearing's were supplied by a mini specialist in Warrington. They are normal roller bearings not the taper bearings I have seen before on disc brake minis. I questioned this at the time and was told that they would be fine. (The box was marked up Metro 1.0 and 1.3 front wheel bearings)

Does anyone know if I should be torqued up to 60lb as per drum braked mini's fitted with roller bearings or 150lb as per disc braked mini's with taper bearings?

The hubs and drive flanges appear to be OK but I have no idea how old they are or if they are worn and will need replacement anyone know what measurements I need to take to establish if they are OK.

Any help or idea's appreciated

Cheers!

[Cooperman]

Is it the metal clips that retain the CV gaiter scraping on the hub carrier? I've had this in the past.
The hub nut should be at the higher torque as the 1275 'S'.

[Island blue]

Is it the metal clips that retain the CV gaiter scraping on the hub carrier? I've had this in the past.
The hub nut should be at the higher torque as the 1275 'S'.

Its got plastic cable ties rather than the metal clips... does not make the noise when the car is jacked up and I rotate the wheel by hand. Noise is difficult to describe but sounds more like a grind / rubbing noise than a tapping or knocking....

Thanks for the info regarding torque.

[Cooperman]

I just noticed that you have ball bearings instead of the taper-roller ones normally fitted to 'S' hubs. I'm now not sure whether the torque for roller bearings is the same as for roller bearings as you should really have taper ones in 'S' hubs.

[daemonchild]

Is it the metal clips that retain the CV gaiter scraping on the hub carrier? I've had this in the past.
The hub nut should be at the higher torque as the 1275 'S'.

I had this when I did mine.
It actually ripped it off and I had to start over.
So got it right the second time. Ahem.

[Island blue]

I just noticed that you have ball bearings instead of the taper-roller ones normally fitted to 'S' hubs. I'm now not sure whether the torque for roller bearings is the same as for roller bearings as you should really have taper ones in 'S' hubs.

No worries... I was not sure that's why I asked! I asked at the local mini shop in stoke today there should not be a problem fitting either sort of bearing to the hub as long as the internal and external diameters are correct, asked about the torque and was told to just belt them up F- tight!


I decided the problem might have been warped discs, I got some replacements today fitted them to the drive flange, I
Tried tightening the hub nut up to 150lb and the disc was catching on the steering arm on the hub . Looking at the back of the old disc there is some scoring, I suspect this may have been where the noise was coming from. Any idea what the clearance should be between the disc and the hub when it is torqued up? I think the hub may be incorrect perhaps a metro one??? anyone know what the difference between an S hub and a metro hub is?

Ta

[GraemeC]

Mini hubs have grease nipples on their ball joints.
Metro hubs use a sealed ball joint - no grease nipple.

[Island blue]

Mini hubs have grease nipples on their ball joints.
Metro hubs use a sealed ball joint - no grease nipple.

Its got Mini Hubs then...

I will pull it to bits and see if they or the drive flange is worn.

Any one know how much clearance there should be between the disc and hub?

Ta.

[Cooperman]

If no-one has a quick answer I'll take a wheel of my 1964 'S' tomorrow and measure the gap. I think it's about 1/4", but can't be sure without checking.
Are you running the disc shields? They can be a source of problems with stones getting between disc and shield.

[Island blue]

If no-one has a quick answer I'll take a wheel of my 1964 'S' tomorrow and measure the gap. I think it's about 1/4", but can't be sure without checking.
Are you running the disc shields? They can be a source of problems with stones getting between disc and shield.

No disc sheilds..

I don't have any clearance to speak of 1-2mm max, its got to be drive flanges and or hubs worn out.

Ta

[M J W J]

Front hubs should have taper roller bearings in and it is best to have them on the back. Taper roller bearings are better suited to taking an axial load (down the shaft) than a straight roller or ball bearing. Straight roller bearings and ball bearings are only designed to take force in one direction. When you turn a corner a car puts a force on its bearings in more than one direction. If you don't have taper roller bearings then it will wear then out a lot quicker than if you do. How long have you had the bearings in?

Drive forward and when the grinding sound occurs steer quite sharply from side to side. If the car goes quieter when steering to the right then the left hand bearings are shot and visa-versa.

The torque wrench setting for your hub nut on a 66 cooper s should be 150 lbf/ft or 207 Nm

[Island blue]

Front hubs should have taper roller bearings in and it is best to have them on the back. Taper roller bearings are better suited to taking an axial load (down the shaft) than a straight roller or ball bearing. Straight roller bearings and ball bearings are only designed to take force in one direction. When you turn a corner a car puts a force on its bearings in more than one direction. If you don't have taper roller bearings then it will wear then out a lot quicker than if you do. How long have you had the bearings in?

Drive forward and when the grinding sound occurs steer quite sharply from side to side. If the car goes quieter when steering to the right then the left hand bearings are shot and visa-versa.

The torque wrench setting for your hub nut on a 66 cooper s should be 150 lbf/ft or 207 Nm

I don't think its worn bearings as they have only done about 250 miles since fitting. I know that the hubs usually have taper bearings in but I was assured that these replacements should be fine. Apparently they were standard fittings on the 1.0 and 1.3 metro. (Its only a 1000cc with a stage one kit perhaps 45 brake if I am lucky!) The noise gets worse when the hub nuts are torqued up to 150lb I am pretty sure the disc is catching on the hub when its loaded up as there was a grove in the back of the disc. Looking between the disc and hub there is very little clearance. Ive taken some measurements from a new drive flange today so I should be able to work out if the drive flange and or the hub is worn out.

[Island blue]

Drive flange is stuffed, looks like the end of it has been machined out!

I am going to replace the drive flanges and bearings this time I will use good quality taper bearings instead of trying to save a few quid...... All I can say is that buying cheapo bearings I have probably cost myself a fortune. Be careful taking advise from people trying to sell you something, cheap stuff ends up costing you in the long run!

Thanks to all those that have posted help and ideas as to what the problem was.