391 replies to this topic

[mike.]

So basically, the main issue we need to clarify here, is what is classed as a modification?

Really, things like brakes/engine/suspension don't really fall into the catagory stated by the IVA: 'the original vehicle or if it has been altered to such an extent that the identity has been lost.'

It sounds more like things like shorties or other crazy conversions.

[Joloke08]

I do apologise if my post on this thread caused any offence it wasnt intended it was just light hearted banter though it is going to worry people if their own "user Modifications" are going to spell lunacy when it comes to an MOT?

In the early days not only were there off the shelf accesories to make life easier but drivers themselves would as little would add little ideas that BMC had never thought of like longer switches moving them closer to the driver etc,no diferent really to when you buy a house and adjusting it to your tastes and making it suit the user ie You

Theres a danger that things will be construed as modified and unsuitable

On a Serious Note though i made Reference to Leepu And berni from Chop Shop i reckon it could put them out of business?
Ive watched in dismay though great television at some of the cars theyve produced and questioned there safety?

that Guy Leepo is Obsessed with Hugeeee Wheel Spacers which must affect the safety and handling of the vehicles,i know i wouldnt want to drive one of their creations

One last thought if this has allready come into force and the Mini if still being built could never ever pass because it needs to be equipped with the likes of colapsing steering coloumn etc How on Earth are Wood and Pickett going to Build the Margarve 50,s allready ordered that they havnt finished yet or maybe not even started? Considering they have said they will be registered as new vehicles ie 09/59 plate.

Just a thought?

Huggz
Jodie

[CMcB]

So basically, the main issue we need to clarify here, is what is classed as a modification?

Really, things like brakes/engine/suspension don't really fall into the catagory stated by the IVA: 'the original vehicle or if it has been altered to such an extent that the identity has been lost.'

It sounds more like things like shorties or other crazy conversions.

Shorties and crazy conversions are the most obvious issues - they WILL require and IVA, and sadly, they WILL fail. As Garrett was trying to explain earlier.

Other mods such as suspension, brakes, wheels, engine - anything mechanical or performance related - SHOULD be declared to DVLA who will most likely say "no further action required". Or you can not declare it, and hope an MoT tester doesnt inform the DVLA who will call you in for an IVA - which your Mini will then fail and be refused registration - and you end up with no Mini.

The law is in place now, but I'm under the impression from Mark's email and Garrett's info that MoT testers will not be doing this until 2012.

For now, it is seriously modified cars that are most affected. Although it would still be best practice to inform the DVLA of any non-standard mods to your Minis.

[robbo]

Taking this in a positive light, and from a minor, not serious mods (for this i mean, spoilers, alloys, brakes, exhausts) then surly this can be of great benefit from a legal and insurance mannor. By this i am reffering to the problems that people come into with claiming insurance after a crash with regards to undeclared modifications.

In theory, if the DVLA and insurance companies talk, then the insurance companies will know what modifications you have, and there is no way to lie and end up with invalid insurance. this will not only protect you if you get hit by one of these drivers (eg, they wont be able lie to the insurers and declare everything) or if you so happen to get insurance revoked after an accident because you did not declare your slightly wider than standard alloy wheels?

I know there are a few bad points, but surly this is an upside?

Also, it will make sure all modifications are legal, and stop people getting away with illegal mods?

PS - I didnt get a chance to read the whole document before it was removed, so im just picking up on what others have said to form this opinion, if i have got the wrong end of the stick i apologise!

Edited by robbo, 14 July 2009 - 02:17 PM.

[CMcB]

That's not quite the point. You would need to declare any mods to the DVLA and the insurance company anyway, thats the law as it stands today.

However, the big issue is the IVA test itself, which makes no discrimination for older cars - hence why any Mini put the IVA will fail because it simply cannot conform to EU 2009 Regulations.

[mike.]

I didn't realise mods had to be declared to the DVLA to be honest. I've got my mods declared to the insurance but not the DVLA...

But now it seems, theres a risk that if i do declare my mods, i may have my mini taken off me because it won't pass an IVA!

What about the people with alloy 4 pot brakes and coil overs?

[BoboGib]

You would need to declare any mods to the DVLA

Where can I find this info? There is nothing (that I can find) on the DVLA website and there is nowhere on the V5 to list them.

[HARBER07]

As above. And how would i go about declaring it to DVLA?

[Joloke08]

One last thought if this has allready come into force and the Mini if still being built could never ever pass because it needs to be equipped with the likes of colapsing steering coloumn etc How on Earth are Wood and Pickett going to Build the Margarve 50,s allready ordered that they havnt finished yet or maybe not even started? Considering they have said they will be registered as new vehicles ie 09/59 plate.

Anybody?
Surely Wood and Pickett are in Trouble Then?

Well and Truely Snookered !

Huggz
Jodie

[garrett3]

Thanks again Craig for doing a better job of explaining what I was trying to.. Good job I dont write for the mags eh?

Edited by garrett3, 14 July 2009 - 03:27 PM.

[BoboGib]

Thanks again Craig for doing a better job of explaining what I was trying to.. Good job I dont write for the mags eh?

And i'm not above saying "I TOLD YOU SO"

No offence mate, as I know you know your stuff, but i've read this post from start to finish and the majority of people were not so much calling you a liar. They were after proof. Craig just provided the proof to back up your OP. So its all good, just need to clear up the few last bits now.

Cheers for the heads up to



Edit : Spelling

Edited by BoboGib, 14 July 2009 - 02:52 PM.

[mike.]

I still can't get my head round how many buinesses will be effected by this. Tuning companies won't sell any of they're big brake kits or coilover kits, and as for 2012 cars being prohibited from any mods at all; I mean what the hell, theres entire buinesses dedicated to this sort of thing?!

[CMcB]

I still can't get my head round how many buinesses will be effected by this. Tuning companies won't sell any of they're big brake kits or coilover kits, and as for 2012 cars being prohibited from any mods at all; I mean what the hell, theres entire buinesses dedicated to this sort of thing?!

We dont know that yet. Some mods the DVLA wont mind, we just dont know which ones yet. The important thing is to declare it, because if they find out it isnt declared they will call you in for an IVA, which a Mini will fail, no matter what upgrades are done, and you'll be out of pocket too.

I am still in touch trying to get more answers.

[mini1976]

"The standards applicable for Normal
IVA are those contained in the relevant European Type Approval Directives.
These require proof of compliance in up to 12 key areas, depending on the
age of the vehicle. These are ;
Seat Belt anchorages (1st July 1991 on)
Protective steering (1st July 1991 on)
Noise and silencers (1st January 1991 on)
Exhaust emissions (1st January 1993 on)
Brakes (1st April 1995 on)
Seat Belt installation (1st July 1997 on)
Co2/ Fuel consumption (1st July 1997)
Fuel Tanks (for gaseous fuels) (1st October 1998)
Anti-Theft device (1st October 1998)
Front impact protection (1st October 2003)
Side impact protection (1st October 2003)
Frontal Protection systems (if fitted) (29th April 2009)"

Doesnt this suggest that as long as you modify a car that was orriginaly made prior to 1991 that you wont have to comply with any more stringent rules than you do at present, providing you retain enough of the orriginal vehicle to retain its identity?

[garrett3]

"The standards applicable for Normal
IVA are those contained in the relevant European Type Approval Directives.
These require proof of compliance in up to 12 key areas, depending on the
age of the vehicle. These are ;
Seat Belt anchorages (1st July 1991 on)
Protective steering (1st July 1991 on)
Noise and silencers (1st January 1991 on)
Exhaust emissions (1st January 1993 on)
Brakes (1st April 1995 on)
Seat Belt installation (1st July 1997 on)
Co2/ Fuel consumption (1st July 1997)
Fuel Tanks (for gaseous fuels) (1st October 1998)
Anti-Theft device (1st October 1998)
Front impact protection (1st October 2003)
Side impact protection (1st October 2003)
Frontal Protection systems (if fitted) (29th April 2009)"

Doesnt this suggest that as long as you modify a car that was orriginaly made prior to 1991 that you wont have to comply with any more stringent rules than you do at present, providing you retain enough of the orriginal vehicle to retain its identity?

This confused me too as the guy sadi my car WILL have to have a 2009 compliant test.
But as you say the above makes a differing statement. Very strange.

Craig has also been told the same as me.

I wonder if they even know what they are doing????