15 replies to this topic

[Asphalt]

Hi!

I have a glas sunroof fitted to my Mini (well, one of the previous owners).
But it leaks and I can't stop it leaking.

Common soltions:
- Fit larger folding roof
- cut of the roof and glue in a new one
- weld it up and put lots of filler on to have sort of a smooth surface

I don't like any of those solutions... Exept the welding-idea.
But there are too many risks and disadvantages.

BUT: I've heard of brazing solder.
I was told there's way less heat involved to brazing solder as with welding.

If that's true - would be well worth a try, thought.

Any guesses if this could be succesfull if carefully done?
Does brazing solder work with non-overlaping panels?



Regards,
Jan

Edited by Asphalt, 22 December 2008 - 01:32 AM.

[buddylove]

I am no expert, but I have heard in this case that its better to replace the whole roof with a non sunroof one.

[peter1968]

hi do you know the make off sunroof as i used

to make sunroofs

[ferrit]

I think for the work involved and the risk of warping the panel when trying to patch a piece in your best bet if you want rid of it completely would be to put a new roof on. Easiest way would be to bond on a f/glass or carbon roof. Even a completely new tin lid would be preferable to patching and filling as it the likelihood of the repair not standing out is slim.

[Boycie]

Yup, most people who patch a roof end up fitting a vinyl roof covering....

[Sam Walters]

you will have to cut the pillers.

there is no way your going to be able to seam weld all that way without warping the panel.

[WiredbyWilson]

you will have to cut the pillers.

there is no way your going to be able to seam weld all that way without warping the panel.

why have to cut the pillars????

I tried to do this and it went horribly wrong and i ended up having a brand new roof skin spot welded on.

I think the CF or FG roof option is your fastest option, as there are 200+ spotwelds holding a roofskin on

[Asphalt]

No chance to get a plastic/carbon roof through TÜV (german MOT equivalent).

I'm well aware of warping the roof - that's why I came with the idea of brazing solder,
as it seems to involve less heat.

@Wilson:
Is it leak-proof now?

@peter1968:
I will have a look. Velm or Autotec or something like this?

Edited by Asphalt, 22 December 2008 - 01:32 PM.

[WiredbyWilson]

@Wilson:
Is it leak-proof now?

There was only one leak - which was my fault for not sealing it before fitting the roof lining.

I have now selaed the roof gutter from the outside which has solved the problem

[basher]

2 get it to look standard and a proper job you would have to get another roof and cut a section out of it to repair so you have the right curves on the repair section. You would then propberly have to stitch weld all the way around ie. do a weld and then leave a gap and do another and then leave a gap, but to be safe you would probs have to leave the roof after each small weld so the heat goes and reduces the risk of warping. It would be a very slow process going around and around till you have got a full seam. And even then when when grinding the weld down you will have to make sure you dont get to much heat into the roof. It could be done but would have to be done slowly. be best off replaceing the hole thing if you want it done quickly

Edited by basher, 22 December 2008 - 01:46 PM.

[robh]

2 get it to look standard and a proper job you would have to get another roof and cut a section out of it to repair so you have the right curves on the repair section. You would then propberly have to stitch weld all the way around ie. do a weld and then leave a gap and do another and then leave a gap, but to be safe you would probs have to leave the roof after each small weld so the heat goes and reduces the risk of warping. It would be a very slow process going around and around till you have got a full seam. And even then when when grinding the weld down you will have to make sure you dont get to much heat into the roof. It could be done but would have to be done slowly. be best off replaceing the hole thing if you want it done quickly

I agree with this, it has been done, if the car was a Porsche 356 you wouldn't have the luxury of lots of cheap parts.

You need a very close fitting repair panel something like 0.5mm gap all round, clean all the metal inside and out, use weld through spray on primer.

Plenty of patience.

As you weld, if you see some panel distortion, get the panel hammer and dolly out and beat it flat whilst its still hot. Then wait until its cooled down and check the panel again.

You don't need to seam weld the gap all the way round, all you need is strong tack welds every 7mm, the filler will waterproof the repair.

When you have it welded in place, you may consider lead loading rather than using filler. Its sounds difficult, but you are on a flat surface and it can be shaped and sanded to make the repair dis-appear.

Happy Christmas

[Asphalt]

That sounds like there's at least a chance of success

I know someone skilled to do this.
I myself still need to learn to weld.
Propblay not the best part to learn

If it fails... Well... There'r still other options left then

Thanks for the input and opinions!
I think I've got an idea of what's possible and not.

Regards and happy christmas,
Jan

Edited by Asphalt, 22 December 2008 - 04:27 PM.

[ferrit]

Well good luck withit hope it goes well.

frohe Weihnachten

[jack_marshall]

Best way is get another non sunroof, roof.

Cut section out that should be where your hole is.. but cut it an inch bigger all round.

Clean paint off the piece round the edges, same on your roof.

Lift it in from underneath and clamp it securely (a self tapper in each corner and 1 or 2 along the straights would help)

Then begin and run short tacks. Start in the corners first then zig zag side to side around the piece.

Let each weld cool off a few seconds before moving on. I'd run these tacks about half an 1/4 inch long and inch or two apart.

If your mig welding it in try turning the welder up enough not to blow holes but enough to weld the 2 pieces together quickly. Alot of people turn the welder down, but this takes longer to run a weld and induces more heat which makes more distortion.

Once youve got it in, sand off the area you need to fill and begin to fill.

If you've made a decent job of welding it in filling it wont be that bad.

This is how I've done a few now and I've finished filling ready to prime in a working day of 8 hours.

[blue redtop]

i braze all day every day and you'll be surprised how hot you have to get it.

its not a solder, and you cant use a soldering iron,

1'st problem is you have you use a soldering torch (flame type not electric). this will burn quite a bit of paint off.

2'nd problem is you have to get the steel so hot its glowing red or the braze wont run and it will turn into loads of blobs and wont run in to the join your brazing.

3'rd problem is the metal will warp with the heat,there's nothing you can do to stop it.


your better of getting a fg roof and bond it on. can be done in less than 2 hours, job done.


sorry to put a downer on the brazing idea but its better someone has told you the not so good bits before you start.

also brazing is expensive and you need a flux to make it run.

cheers
jay